We do not use the real time policy for all the Timeline stuff. Am I using real time for Netflix shows? NO Am I using real time for Civil Wasr? NO... I do not use prop as newspapers or cell phone dates... I do not have to say why... We use the statement from actors or showrunners or directors or Kevin Feige and the statement that the characters says in the movies/series... In CATWS I do not care that October 2013 date we can see... THEY SAY 2 YEARS AFTER THE AVENGERS... SO IT IS 2014. Also you should review Civil War, they say that the HYDRA Uprising happen two years ago not three. The Avengers had been operating for 4 wyears with unlimited power. Daredevil according Charlie Cox takes place roughly six months after Season 1 and Kingpin says several months in episode 10, It could be in April 2015 as the real time date said but we have the winter in Jessica Jones to worry about so that is why I have Daredevil 1 in 2015 followed by Jessica Jones Season 1 then Luke Cage (I never used to think that it could happen in real time .-.) and finally Daredevil Season 2. And the winter statement on Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. Season 2 could be metaphorically. I do not use newspapers date because that is not as the MCU Works... I only said to you some evidence but I think that you do not like to someome to be not agree with you...
Marvel Cinematic Universe - Timeline
- Thread starter DIrishB
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DIrishB
The Timeline Guy
Jesus... there is no logical through line to your approach is the point. Sometimes you do, sometimes you don't? That makes literally not a whit of sense, man. Also, apparently you are using real time for Civil War since you claim it begins in May, same time it was released.
You can't pick and choose approaches like that because it is inherently illogical. And logic is an important factor in determining placements on the timeline.
You're free to do what you like, just as I am. The difference is one of us realizes the props are intentionally dated for a reason (they're not just using random dates on newspapers). You don't have to say why, but your inability to do so shows the holes in your approach.
It's never said in the film itself that it's 2 years after Avengers. That was an off the cuff remark from one of the producers. Further, such statements should be taken with a large grain of salt. Mike Colter originally said Luke Cage occurred a "few months after Jessica Jones", yet we know Jessica Jones occurred in Winter to early Spring of 2015, and according to Charlie Cox's statement Luke Cage occurs around same time as Daredevil Season 2, which definitively occurs from November to December, 2015. That's a hell of a lot more than a "few months", and actually closer to a year.
Thus, again, your approach is inherently illogical.
Winter Soldier is set in October, 2013. Civil War is set in March/April, 2016. That's 2 and a half years. Again, such estimates happen ALL the time, in both fiction and the real world. It's closer to 2 years then 3, something your math seems to have overlooked.
Which aligns almost perfectly with the first Avengers film being set in May, 2012, short by only a month.
I don't know why we have to keep going in circles. Daredevil Season 2 clearly occurs over Nov/Dec. It ends at Christmastime, so December, 2015. By following the passage of days and dialogue which mentions how much time has passed, it's very clear the entire second Season of Daredevil occurs from Nov-Dec. You continually ignore even blatantly obvious clues like that, so I'm sorry, but your approach is definitively suspect and illogical and disputes hard data from the films and television episodes themselves.
Also, the fact Cox claimed it was 6 months in an interview and Fisk in the show several months should tell you that Cox may have no clue about the timeline. Several is usually classified as 3-4, not 6. Also, Fisk says it's been several months since they last saw each other (if I recall correctly, I may be remembering wrong). That doesn't mean several months since Season 1. Even if it was "several months" in relation to how long Fisk had been locked up there could only apply to that particular prison (he may have been at another prison and transferred, etc).
And yet, that's the approach you consistently use, even flying in the face of dates shown in the films that dispute that real world approach. Sorry you don't agree, but the evidence is on my side, and I've outlined multiple instances of your real world release date approach being incorrect.
"He's been chasing us all winter." That's not metaphorical, lol. Now you're just being ridiculous.
Do yourself a favor. Look up the term "cognitive dissonance" and see how that applies to the mindset you're utilizing here. You are absolutely ignoring the hard evidence available in favor of forcing placements that don't make any sense. When you ignore verifiable, hard data that conflicts with preconceived notions, you're suffering from cognitive dissonance, and this is a clear example of that on your part.
Says who? Lol. You don't speak for the MCU, man. The newspaper dates shown throughout the MCU are intentionally dated to reflect the time they occur at. The prop department goes out of their way to reflect dates like that. It's blatantly obvious, hence why the newspapers reflect dates close to the real world dates, off by maybe a few months at most.
The is why the newspaper dates in Captain America - The First Avenger and Agent Carter reflected their 1940's settings, just as the films set in modern day reflect dates that align with current time. That's intentional, and meant to be taken as a reflection of when the films occur.
I have no problem with peopl disagreeing, but use logic to do so. Literally every step of this debate you have ignored hard, blatantly obvious evidence in favor of forcing release date timeline placements, which does work sometimes, but not always. I utilize info from the films themselves.
You should research the old continuity approach the old Star Wars Expanded Universe used to utilize. They took a tiered approach to it, with the films as the highest unalterable tier, then the spin off comics, novels, video games, etc at varying tiers underneath the films, since sometimes there were continuity problems and one had to be chosen over the other. The tier system allowed them to organize which was canon and which was overridden.
In the MCU timeline's case, I utilize a similar approach. If it's shown in the films/TV episodes, that's first tier of canon and overrides everything else, including random comments made in interviews with directors/writers/producers. Comments made my actors/directors/producers are second tier of canon, meaning if something in the films/episodes conflicts with comments made in real world interviews, the films/episodes override those comments.
Further, learn to acknowledge estimates. You're holding to "2 years" as if it's exactly 24 months, when it likely isn't. My niece is 2, she'll turn 3 years old in a couple weeks. But guess what: until her birthday, she's still 2 years old.
Please utilize some common sense, man.
If you have logical info, I'm happy to listen. I even acknowledged and utilized your suggestions for AoS Season 2 placements, but most of your other suggestions are full of logical holes, and I can't abide choosing a less logical approach like the one you're using. Logic is key to such timeline debates, and you're simply not utilizing it. Sometimes you use real world dates, sometimes not. Waaaaaay too fluid and illogical, especially when you ignore HARD onscreen dates and dialogue in favor of forcing the release date approach. That doesn't fly here. Feel free to make your own timeline and order it however you want, but I'm utilizing logic and hard data on this one.
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wyokid
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wyokid
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Huh, well that's interesting.
Captain Canuck
The poster formerly known as captaincanuck65
I think Marvel is soon going to do away with the "real-time" placement of these movies. They're going to want to make more than one or two high school movies with Spider-Man, which will mean they are going to take place pretty close together rather than 3 years apart like their release dates. That is going to screw up the timeline for everyone else unless they likewise set them closer together. Or they could just sort of ignore the problems, but that would be super frustrating.
Yeah, I definitely wonder how they're going to deal with the timeline as they continue. It'll be weird if Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 2 takes place only two months later; and then the characters appear later on in Avengers: Infinity War set in 2018. What will have happened to the character in the meantime? What will they have been up to for four years?
Similarly with Spider-Man: Homecoming, I'm wondering if the film will take place in September 2016, rather than September 2017. Recently, Kevin Feige said that each Spidey film could cover a school year, with the possibility of films occurring over summer break too. If so, it could end up being weird though if Spider-Man appears in Avengers: Infinity War and then later films occur prior to that film.
DIrishB
The Timeline Guy
Awesome. We knew it picked up soon after the first film, but the 2 months statement is helpful... unfortunately we don't know exactly when in 2014 the first film happened.
Yeah, I think the first option is far more likely, especially since a couple upcoming projects (GotG Vol 2 and Luke Cage) are confirmed as soon after the previous film in GotG's case, and occurring just before or during Daredevil Season 2 in Luke Cage's case.
Thats why I think its actually likely Spider-Man: Homecoming occurs in 2017. Avengers - Infinity War will likely be set the same year its released, so that allows only a year to pass between Spider-Man - Homecoming and Avengers Infinity War.
It really just depends on how long Peter has been acting as Spider-Man in Homecoming. It was said he'd been doing it for around six months in Civil War if I recall correctly, so if any mentions are made regarding how long he's had his powers in Homecoming that may help pin it down more.
iammattie
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Apparently a bunch of Marvel info was leaked at 4Chan, and repost on Reddit. Some interesting points for the timeline:
- Doctor Strange takes place simultaneously to the MCU, with Stephen Strange's accident happening shortly after Tony Stark returns from Afghanistan and his training spanning all the other movies
- There are already plans for a sequel with Benedict Cumberbatch and Chiwetel Ejiofor certain to return, but there are no other developments as of right now
- GoTG Vol 2 ending leads directly to "Avengers: Infinity War"
- There are plans for a sequel, but James Gunn still isn't officially attached to write and direct, although Marvel wants him to direct.
- Stark mentions he's keeping the Accords off of Peter's back because he's only dealing with minor street crimes, but might not be able to protect him if he keeps branching out to dealing with supervillains (so definitely after Civil War)
- Doctor Strange will have a cameo in Thor Ragnarok
- Erik Kilmonger is the main villain of Black Panther, and his plan revolves around the Accords. Secretary Ross and Tony Stark are making appearances, and Bucky is being brought off of ice (so once again, definitely after Civil War if that wasn't already obvious)
- Ant-Man and The Wasp will center on Scott Lang and Hope Van Dyne on the run after the events of "Captain America: Civil War", trying to prevent the Ant-Man technology from falling into the wrong hands.
- Captain Marvel, Carol Danvers will be introduced and get her powers in "Avengers: Infinity War" after an encounter with Kree technology during a battle with Thanos
- Marvel and Fox have improved relations lately, with Marvel authorizing that "Deadpool" feature a Helicarrier. Fox is holding on to the X-Men, but recognize they could be managing the property better, and there's talks of Marvel helping out with mapping out an expansive X-Men movie universe revamp that better uses the properties in exchange for getting the Fantastic Four back
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DIrishB
The Timeline Guy
Updated for Doctor Strange Prelude #2.
Given the info revealed that Doctor Strange has been training since 2008 or so, I'm wondering if the Prelude comics don't occur before 2008, since Strange is nowhere to be seen in them, and presumably he would be if they occurred while he was training under Ancient One, etc.
Thats awesome, and also makes perfect sense in allowing the time for Strange to train and truly become a master of the mystic arts. Very cool info. Once the film is released and I get a chance to see it I'll do tentative placement for sections of the film spanning whichever portions of the existing MCU timeline it occurs at.
Very cool info. Fantastic Four coming back would be a great way to either open or close off Phase 4 of the MCU.
Given the info revealed that Doctor Strange has been training since 2008 or so, I'm wondering if the Prelude comics don't occur before 2008, since Strange is nowhere to be seen in them, and presumably he would be if they occurred while he was training under Ancient One, etc.
Thats awesome, and also makes perfect sense in allowing the time for Strange to train and truly become a master of the mystic arts. Very cool info. Once the film is released and I get a chance to see it I'll do tentative placement for sections of the film spanning whichever portions of the existing MCU timeline it occurs at.
Very cool info. Fantastic Four coming back would be a great way to either open or close off Phase 4 of the MCU.
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Captain Canuck
The poster formerly known as captaincanuck65
If that's all true, then it's very cool. Especially getting F4 back. But it still makes me a bit sad that the X-Men won't be joining the MCU. I mean, if they're going to revamp it anyway...
iammattie
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DIrishB
The Timeline Guy
Never say never. I think there's a decent chance once they do officially reboot it (after next Wolverine movie), they could do so to establish it as a part of the MCU. If Spider-Man: Homecoming proves to be a reliable financial and critical success compared to the last few Spidey films, that'll show Marvel Studios involvement worked, and could be a lucrative launching point for a rebooted X-Men film franchise as a part of the MCU but still it's own little corner. Establish the mutants as a new mutation on the Inhuman gene that's already established in Agents of SHIELD and presumably in the far off Inhumans film. Different from the comic but actually slightly more plausible if accounting for the advanced gene coding done by the Kree versus random happenstance mutations like in the original comic canon.
Anyway, when you compare the excitement level for a rebooted X-Men film franchise versus a rebooted X-Men film franchise set in the MCU, which will develop more excitement, more buzz, and likely bigger ticket sales? The latter, most definitely. It's only a matter of seeing if the increased profits and better reception Marvel's hand tends to play in critical reception (even their crappier the movies still get 65-80% RT scores) is enough of a motivating factor to get them and their respective legal teams to work out a character and profit sharing and production cost sharing deal. We'll see.
But just about everyone wants to see the X-Men and Fantastic Four properties come home. The impending reboot for the X-Men films would be the perfect time to hammer out and utilize such a character sharing deal.
Batman v Superman?
Wolverine v Hulk would be a billion dollar plus easy if done well, and it'd be kind of hard to screw that up, truthfully.
It'd be a great way to kick off a crossover element to the universe, and a hefty profit (with smaller production costs for each studio since costs are shared to some degree, meaning a savings either way from production standpoint/upfront costs), and could sort of serve as a bit of an answer to Batman v Superman, lol.
Anyway, when you compare the excitement level for a rebooted X-Men film franchise versus a rebooted X-Men film franchise set in the MCU, which will develop more excitement, more buzz, and likely bigger ticket sales? The latter, most definitely. It's only a matter of seeing if the increased profits and better reception Marvel's hand tends to play in critical reception (even their crappier the movies still get 65-80% RT scores) is enough of a motivating factor to get them and their respective legal teams to work out a character and profit sharing and production cost sharing deal. We'll see.
But just about everyone wants to see the X-Men and Fantastic Four properties come home. The impending reboot for the X-Men films would be the perfect time to hammer out and utilize such a character sharing deal.
Batman v Superman?
Wolverine v Hulk would be a billion dollar plus easy if done well, and it'd be kind of hard to screw that up, truthfully.
It'd be a great way to kick off a crossover element to the universe, and a hefty profit (with smaller production costs for each studio since costs are shared to some degree, meaning a savings either way from production standpoint/upfront costs), and could sort of serve as a bit of an answer to Batman v Superman, lol.
iammattie
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So, I started watching Iron Man 2 again, and during the Senate hearing Justin Hammer says "In the last 6 months, Anthony Stark has created a sword with untold possibilities" in reference to the Iron Man suit. So wouldn't this throw the "this is 6 months after Vanko finishes his suit, not 6 months after after Iron Man 1" theory out the window?
vintsukka
Well-Known Member
But the mention of the Dark Elves in London in #1 throws a wrench into that. Of course, the two issues aren't connected, so you could say #2 occurs before 2008 and #1 later, but that's clearly not how it was intended.
There are several references in Iron Man 2 suggesting it takes place six months to a year after the first film, so that theory was always a little iffy. The problem is that there are also references showing that Thor and the Hulk take place at almost the same time, and there are other references to the events of those films in relation to Avengers, Dark World, etc. DIrishB changed his timeline to account for that by placing Iron Man in 2010 for awhile to be consistent with the Iron Man 2 references, but Civil War states that the events of Iron Man took place eight years before that film.
Long story short: Yes, Iron Man 2 thinks it takes place not long after the first film, but the film writers have decided the first Iron Man takes place when it was released, leaving anyone creating a timeline the unhappy choice of either being consistent with all the references in Iron Man 2 or every movie from Avengers forward.
I think the only possible solution at this point would be to stretch the events of the last part of Iron Man 2, and then Thor, the Hulk, and the Avengers out over a longer period of time to cover the two year gap, but I don't think that would stand up to close scrutiny.TC
selfishmisery
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Ah, continuity paradoxes.
I would just assume Justin was referring to a new armor Tony built; coincidentally around the same time Vanko started building his armor.
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the watcher
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