Wanted to get an opinion on Iron Man 2/Fury's Big Week. In Iron Man 2, Tony goes to see Pepper at her office, while there she says on the phone that Hammer has a demonstration "tomorrow night." Later Tony returns to his house and Coulson leaves for New Mexico. Now, in FBW the day Coulson leaves we cut to the Stark Expo fight with a "Later that night." So, what do you guys think? Is Iron Man 2 wrong or is FBW? Is the expo the day Coulson leaves or the day after?
Marvel Cinematic Universe - Timeline
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wyokid
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Actually, Marvel came out and said this is the only thing in continuity.
iammattie
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If IM2 Dialogue says it's the next day, nut FBW has a text box saying later that night rather than actual character dialogue, I'm more inclined to go with IM2
Hurricanebtvs
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I've just edited Civil War into my edit. SO SO easy to splice. Thank you Russo's.
DIrishB
The Timeline Guy
Nope. It was originally intended that way then later retconned.
The quote in Avengers that Fury makes that the events of Thor were last year places Thor definitively in 2011. Fury's Big Week comic establishes Thor, Incredible Hulk, and Iron Man 2 all occurring in the same year/around same time with notable crossover elements. This is also backed up by the background screens at the scene towards end where Fury tells Stark they won't be using him for Avengers Initiative, which show the battle at university campus shown in Incredible Hulk.
Thus, Iron Man 2 must be viewed as occurring in 2011 and not 2009 as originally intended.
Ah, good point, forgot about that. I have them placed currently around middle of the year for 2016. Maybe a few months before the events of the film.
Guess the comic disputes the rumor that Doctor Strange got his powers years ago, then.
There are several references in Iron Man 2 suggesting it takes place six months to a year after the first film, so that theory was always a little iffy. The problem is that there are also references showing that Thor and the Hulk take place at almost the same time, and there are other references to the events of those films in relation to Avengers, Dark World, etc. DIrishB changed his timeline to account for that by placing Iron Man in 2010 for awhile to be consistent with the Iron Man 2 references, but Civil War states that the events of Iron Man took place eight years before that film.
Long story short: Yes, Iron Man 2 thinks it takes place not long after the first film, but the film writers have decided the first Iron Man takes place when it was released, leaving anyone creating a timeline the unhappy choice of either being consistent with all the references in Iron Man 2 or every movie from Avengers forward.I think the only possible solution at this point would be to stretch the events of the last part of Iron Man 2, and then Thor, the Hulk, and the Avengers out over a longer period of time to cover the two year gap, but I don't think that would stand up to close scrutiny.
TC
Yeah; there really is no place to insert a span of two years or more passing except at the beginning while Vanko is building suit. The rest of the film occurs over a period of a couple weeks at most if I recall correctly (I have to go back and double check but the Stark Expo had a few background mentions on props and in dialogue (from reporter) mentioning "Day 1 of Stark Expo", etc. But I'm pretty sure the film occurs over 2, maybe 3 weeks maximum.
It's one of those things we just have to grin and bear: they retconned it so there's an unavoidable continuity screw up.
Yep. Not a great explanation but one we have to assume to make sense of it, I guess.
I was seriously asked this over on thetimelinesite... but in case you're seriously asking and for anyone else wondering, it's obviously not canon. Just a parody/joke thing.
The films are the highest level of canon, so they always override other stuff like the TV series and comics if there's a continuity issue (with the exception of Fury's Big Week overriding Iron Man's 2 being 2+ years after the first movie and not only 6 months). So in this case, definitely the film. The timeline has it laid out as such, that it occurs the next day. Tony goes to visit Pepper at the office, notices the old Stark Expo model and goes home to create the new element which likely took at least the night. My assumption was always that he went home, watched the video, began working on the new element, and finished it the next day. If you look on timeline, IM2 Ch 12 "Pepper's Office" and part of Ch 13 "New Element" occurs on May 31, 2011 and the latter portion of Ch 13 "New Element" occurs on June 1, 2011.
So, does this timeline just ignore the 05.06.2010 date on Tony's computer in Iron Man 2
Hurricanebtvs
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Much like the 2009/2010 dates in the Daredevil flashback, they were ignored due to a later retcon.
Like, Marvel officially retconned them or...?
Hurricanebtvs
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Like DB has said about Iron Man 2, Fury's Big Week and Avengers retconned it to happen in 2011.
As for Daredevil, I forget what happened but there was an episode in season 2 that places the college flashbacks in 2005.
As for Daredevil, I forget what happened but there was an episode in season 2 that places the college flashbacks in 2005.
DIrishB
The Timeline Guy
Yes. Either the 2008 date on Tony's computer must be ignored or the 2010 date in IM2. The 2008 date in IM1 overrides the IM2 date since it's backed up by Vision's comment in Civil War that Iron Man 1 occurred 8 years ago.
Exactly. In those instances Marvel sort of retconned themselves.
Not "officially". They didn't have a press conference or interview openly stating the retcon, but the dialogue/dates shown or mentioned in the films did in some form of an official capacity.
Daredevil Season 1 had a flashback that showed Foggy meeting Matt as roommates in college and shows Foggy signing up for Fall classes for the 2008 semester on his laptop. But dialogue/flashbacks in DD Season 2 establishes that Matt and Elektra met while he was in college a decade prior, placing those flashbacks in 2005.
Bob_A_Mickelson
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Why does the timeline show the opening conflict to civil war occurring on march 21 when the WHIH report shows it occurred on May 3rd?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4_Wou74TE7A
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4_Wou74TE7A
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Because they do not follow real time, and they are ignoring this May 3rd date...
Bob_A_Mickelson
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Where do they supersede this date? Ant-man followed the Whih dates. Does civil war itself give any dates to the contrary?
Yes there is a newspaper with the March 21, 2016 date but I do not count it because we have an explicit date on WHiH release video
iammattie
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DIrishB
The Timeline Guy
Updated for all episode titles of Luke Cage.
Because real world release dates don't necessarily correspond with dates within the MCU. That promo was released on May 3 in our world, doesn't mean thats the case in the MCU. No internal dates are provided in those videos.
Plus, the Lagos scenes are very clearly dated as March 21 based on the newspapers seen on the table in front of Wanda in that opening scene where Cap is talking her through her training.
That also perfectly lines up timeline wise with the date shown on the Fedex package at end of movie (the letter Steve sent Tony) showing delivery date of April 14.
Again, real world release dates don't define internal dates of the MCU.
Right, because we have a hard date through a bit of deductive reasoning available within the film itself. Actually two dates that line up perfectly with the film's internal chronology.
Yes, hard dates on newspaper at beginning in Lagos and on Fedex package at end of film. Also, one of the Ant-Man videos had a hard date within mentioned, and didn't contradict what was in the film itself (in fact it supported it), whereas Civil War's internal dates dispute the real world release dates of the promo videos.
The films always override anything else, most especially when they intentionally portray dates to convey their internal timeline. Release dates are ALWAYS trumped by that.
And as we already covered, its illogical to ignore hard dates in the films themselves in favor of using release dates, especially when those release dates clash with the internal dating. As said, you don't set Iron Man 3 in May even though thats when it was released. You set it in December because its Christmastime within the film itself.
Same with Captain America - The First Avenger. You don't set it in 2011 (except the bookend scenes) when the majority takes place in the 1940's. Or with Agent Carter, etc. Luke Cage is said to occur a few months after Jessica Jones, so are you going to ignore that and utilize its release date instead? How many holes do I need to poke in your approach before you realize its an illogical and incorrect approach?
Utilizing release dates that override hard dates provided in the movies themselves makes no sense, man.
And then when you compound that illogical approach by only using release dates sometimes and not others, with no logic or consistency behind it... its a thoroughly uneven approach that'll inevitable result in major continuity problems.
Yeah, I'm taking that to mean 2 months Earth time.
Because real world release dates don't necessarily correspond with dates within the MCU. That promo was released on May 3 in our world, doesn't mean thats the case in the MCU. No internal dates are provided in those videos.
Plus, the Lagos scenes are very clearly dated as March 21 based on the newspapers seen on the table in front of Wanda in that opening scene where Cap is talking her through her training.
That also perfectly lines up timeline wise with the date shown on the Fedex package at end of movie (the letter Steve sent Tony) showing delivery date of April 14.
Again, real world release dates don't define internal dates of the MCU.
Right, because we have a hard date through a bit of deductive reasoning available within the film itself. Actually two dates that line up perfectly with the film's internal chronology.
Yes, hard dates on newspaper at beginning in Lagos and on Fedex package at end of film. Also, one of the Ant-Man videos had a hard date within mentioned, and didn't contradict what was in the film itself (in fact it supported it), whereas Civil War's internal dates dispute the real world release dates of the promo videos.
The films always override anything else, most especially when they intentionally portray dates to convey their internal timeline. Release dates are ALWAYS trumped by that.
And as we already covered, its illogical to ignore hard dates in the films themselves in favor of using release dates, especially when those release dates clash with the internal dating. As said, you don't set Iron Man 3 in May even though thats when it was released. You set it in December because its Christmastime within the film itself.
Same with Captain America - The First Avenger. You don't set it in 2011 (except the bookend scenes) when the majority takes place in the 1940's. Or with Agent Carter, etc. Luke Cage is said to occur a few months after Jessica Jones, so are you going to ignore that and utilize its release date instead? How many holes do I need to poke in your approach before you realize its an illogical and incorrect approach?
Utilizing release dates that override hard dates provided in the movies themselves makes no sense, man.
And then when you compound that illogical approach by only using release dates sometimes and not others, with no logic or consistency behind it... its a thoroughly uneven approach that'll inevitable result in major continuity problems.
Yeah, I'm taking that to mean 2 months Earth time.
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Bob_A_Mickelson
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Thanks D. Sound reasoning as always. Great work.
DIrishB
The Timeline Guy
Updated for Agents of SHIELD 4x01 episode title "The Ghost". Looking forward to that.
Thanks Bob!
Thanks Bob!
Do we? Where is the date presented other than simplying saying "that was when it was released?"
wyokid
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I wonder if, because it takes place far away, if time works differently. That or Time Gem shenanigans are coming.
