Pro Bot
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Drake Winston is in the novel, so Batman: Resurrection is 10000% in the same timeline as the Batman '89 comics.
Batman/Superman Anthology Timelines
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ItzStitch626
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Noticed a mistake here
Maybe in this universe he is played by Shawn Wayans instead though… wink
Pro Bot
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Two notes:
1. Hugo Strange appears heavily in Batman: Resurrection. He is referenced in Batman '89: Echoes posthumously. I love this because it feels like a hidden storyline that informs the overall storyline of this Batman iteration.
2. Okay, I'm going mad. I could SWEAR I saw the "Forget the Super" newspaper in one of the films, specifically Superman II. I even recall seeing the back of the newspaper and how it was identical to what is seen in the Human Target comic. However, I've tried finding it in the films recently and I honestly couldn't. According to auctions and movie prop sites, it is absolutely an officially produced newspaper for the 1978 film but was not actually featured in it. I'll look out for it more closely on my next rewatch regardless.
If it seriously wasn't featured, you could make the argument that the Human Target comic makes the "Forget the Super" newspaper canon, only it was written and published in the 2000s rather than the 1970s. If this is the case, the newspaper depicts Christopher Reeve's Superman between the events of Superman IV: The Quest for Peace and the brief cameo in The Flash... and thus, Human Target is "canon". I'm positive that wasn't intended when the show was made and I'm sure DC have completely forgot about the comic tie-in though, so yeah, it's still a very odd situation and you can easily ignore it completely and that makes total sense.
1. Hugo Strange appears heavily in Batman: Resurrection. He is referenced in Batman '89: Echoes posthumously. I love this because it feels like a hidden storyline that informs the overall storyline of this Batman iteration.
2. Okay, I'm going mad. I could SWEAR I saw the "Forget the Super" newspaper in one of the films, specifically Superman II. I even recall seeing the back of the newspaper and how it was identical to what is seen in the Human Target comic. However, I've tried finding it in the films recently and I honestly couldn't. According to auctions and movie prop sites, it is absolutely an officially produced newspaper for the 1978 film but was not actually featured in it. I'll look out for it more closely on my next rewatch regardless.
If it seriously wasn't featured, you could make the argument that the Human Target comic makes the "Forget the Super" newspaper canon, only it was written and published in the 2000s rather than the 1970s. If this is the case, the newspaper depicts Christopher Reeve's Superman between the events of Superman IV: The Quest for Peace and the brief cameo in The Flash... and thus, Human Target is "canon". I'm positive that wasn't intended when the show was made and I'm sure DC have completely forgot about the comic tie-in though, so yeah, it's still a very odd situation and you can easily ignore it completely and that makes total sense.
I finished the audiobook today. I am starting to wonder if the long delays in Batman 89 Echos are due to efforts to reconcile it with this book. Without spoiling there is a character setup in the book who is appearing in Echos. The next book could be the backstory for where they end up in Echos.
I remember when The Flash came out there was surprise that the comic creators were not informed of what movie was doing. But ultimately it made no difference. That movie is decades in the future from anything in the comics. Besides the altered timeline questions. Nothing contradicts anything. All we see is an old Bruce Wayne. No mention of other unseen characters
But these new books and the comics are a totally different situation. Both are close to the other time wise and over lap in characters. Plus there has been a lot of changes in DC and WB in recent years. Would not surprise if a dictate came from above to coordinate things between. The small references in other DC books are mostly Easter Eggs. Which do not always line up.
But these prose novels and comic books are being sold under the same Burtonverse label at almost exactly the same time. Makes sense to both go in parallel tracks even if they are not telling same stories.
I remember when The Flash came out there was surprise that the comic creators were not informed of what movie was doing. But ultimately it made no difference. That movie is decades in the future from anything in the comics. Besides the altered timeline questions. Nothing contradicts anything. All we see is an old Bruce Wayne. No mention of other unseen characters
But these new books and the comics are a totally different situation. Both are close to the other time wise and over lap in characters. Plus there has been a lot of changes in DC and WB in recent years. Would not surprise if a dictate came from above to coordinate things between. The small references in other DC books are mostly Easter Eggs. Which do not always line up.
But these prose novels and comic books are being sold under the same Burtonverse label at almost exactly the same time. Makes sense to both go in parallel tracks even if they are not telling same stories.
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selfishmisery
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Yeah I think under Gunn there will be a lot more focus/importance on consistent continuity between these books or comics based on pre-existing continuities.
Pro Bot
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The Hydroplolis event is dated "Saturday, July 25", which places Catwoman in 1998 or 2009. July 21-28, 2009 is probably a safe bet.
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Pro Bot
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I always thought it was weird how Superman Returns suggests that the Kryptonite from the first film was discovered in 1978 in the Singerverse, just like the Donnerverse. That literally implies that the original film happened in 1978 regardless of the 2006 setting. Maybe it landed and was discovered earlier in that reality, and the year just coincides with the first movie coincidentally.
I came across this old screenshot, lol. Marc is so dumb here, there's an obvious answer in that Lana Lang mixed up Clark's mom and dad. Clark planning on selling the farm before deciding against it... doesn't that same thing happen in Smallville? But, nah. His explanation was that Clark is a bad son and that's why Martha resurrects herself from the dead (???).
I think Marc's personal interpretation of the Pre-Crisis Earth-96 timeline was:
1978 - Superman: The Movie
1978 - Superman II
1980 - Superman III
1984 - Supergirl
1985 - Superman IV: The Quest for Peace
2006 - Superman Returns
2019 - Crisis on Infinite Earths
It's kinda funny to think about, because Clark goes to Krypton to search for survivors, meanwhile, in Superman '78, his parents are alive. Did someone accidentally step on the Bottle City of Kandor, so Clark left Earth to have a good cry about it? And no one suspects 71 year old Clark Kent is Superman despite his lack of aging, lol. I guess, in Marc's eyes at least, no one really ages, they just change their face.
JudgeDreddpool
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I mean, this is the same asshole that joked about wanting to see MJ being r*ped and murdered in the Spider-Man comics for the infamous One More Day arc and still defends that comment to this day. (And no, I'm not making that up, you can find it here: )
And he had the audacity to whine about James Gunn not picking him for the team developing the DCU.
Bruh
JudgeDreddpool
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If it wasn't obvious, Guggenheim is largely the reason why I'm that hesitant to get into the Arrowverse, since he's both a talentless hack and a misogynistic piece of shit.
JudgeDreddpool
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Anyways, not gonna talk further about it. Am exhausted from IRL today, so not really in the right mood.
Pro Bot
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Suppose we go with multiverse changes to explain how it's connected, and suppose we agree with Superman Returns SOMEHOW being part of the Donnerverse, I think this is what it'd look like. Personally, I prefer the idea that after Crisis, all main media realities were reborn exactly the same, just without the Crisis happening... but if we don't, then that essentially means none of the Pre-Crisis realities actually depicted the on-screen versions but rather identical versions of them that didn't exist in the same universe. See, that's why I don't like it, along with Superman Returns not fitting perfectly as a proper sequel despite Crisis being written as if it were.
(Vicki Vale and "caped wonders" were mentioned in Superman Returns: Prequel #4 so I guess that fits, but most likely referencing the unseen Singerverse Vicki and Batman rather than Keaton)
Anyway, that would look like this, just for scientific purposes. I'd rather separate the Donnerverse from Superman Returns and have those films as Earth-89 (which I will continue to do), but for argument's sake and because it's a fun topic:
Pre-Crisis
Earth-89 (Note: Events might be slightly different to what we see in the films)
1989 - Batman
1992 - Batman Returns
2009 - Catwoman
2019 - Supergirl 5x09, "Crisis on Infinite Earths: Part 1"
Earth-96 (Note: Events might be slightly different to what we see in the films)
1948 - Superman Returns: Prequel #1
1978 - Superman: The Movie: Extended Cut
1978 - Superman II
1980 - Superman III
1984 - Supergirl: Director's Cut
1985 - Superman IV: The Quest for Peace
2006 - Superman Returns: Prequel #3-4
2006 - Superman Returns
2010 - Human Target 1x01-1x12
2010 - Human Target vol. 3 #1-6
2011 - Human Target 2x01-2x13
2019 - Batwoman 2x09, "Crisis on Infinite Earths: Part 2"
Earth-97
1995 - Batman Forever
1995 - Batman & Robin: Robin: Facing the Enemy
1997 - Batman & Robin
1997 - Batman & Robin: Batgirl: To Dare the Darkness
Post-Crisis
Earth-1/Flashpoint [Batman/Batman Returns occur slightly differently, probably]
1989 - Batman
1992 - Batman Returns
2022 - The Flash
Earth-96 (Earth-789)
1948 - Superman Returns: Prequel #1
1978 - Superman: The Movie: Extended Cut
1978 - Superman II
1979 - Superman '78 #1-6
1979 - Superman '78: The Metal Curtain #1-6
1980 - Superman III
1984 - Supergirl: Director's Cut
1985 - Superman IV: The Quest for Peace
1989 - Batman
1990 - Batman: Resurrection
1992 - Batman Returns
1993 - Catwoman 80th Anniversary, "Now You See Me"
1993 - Batman '89 #1-6
1995 - Batman '89: Echoes #1-6
1996 - Batman vol. 3 #135 [Keaton scene only]
1996 - Dark Crisis: Big Bang [Earth-789 scene only]
2006 - Superman Returns: Prequel #3-4
2006 - Superman Returns
2009 - Catwoman
2010 - Human Target 1x01-1x12
2010 - Human Target vol. 3 #1-6
2011 - Human Target 2x01-2x13
2020 - DC's Legends of Tomorrow 5x00, "Crisis on Infinite Earths: Part 5" [Earth-96 scene only]
2022 - The Flash [Reeve and Slater cameos only]
Earth-97 [closely related to Earth-96]
1995 - Batman Forever
1995 - Batman & Robin: Robin: Facing the Enemy
1997 - Batman & Robin
1997 - Batman & Robin: Batgirl: To Dare the Darkness
If they ever connected The Flash (1990-1991) (probably won't happen since Dark Crisis states Superman/Supergirl are the world's only powered heroes, but Central City has been referenced in two Batman '89 tie-ins), I'd probably employ this logic. Lois Lane was actually referenced on that series, along with Superman and Batman being in-universe films, so that'd be interesting. Anyway, that's me going on an unrelated tangent.
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Jack Wayne
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¿?
So Lois is like 70s and looks like 40 years younger?
idk
that kryptonite thing in returns made me think that the timeline is this one
1975 Krypton explote
1978 Superman and the kryptonite arrives to earth
1996-1997 Superman The Movie (the only official statement about Clark age in Returns and the prequels is "over 21", they never mention that he was 30 when he became superman so that is a change imo)
2001 Superman II & Maybe Supergirl in the post crisis timeline
2006 Superman Returns
2007 Superman III (Fits with the 15 year class reunion of the movie)
2012 Superman IV
2013 The Flash Superman and Supergirl cameo
2018 Joker thing in metropolis
2019 Crisis
2020 End of Crisis
ItzStitch626
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Are these mistakes?
Pro Bot
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Nah, she'd be in her 40s/50s and look 20-30 years younger. Not quite as bad.
Pro Bot
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Yep! thank you.
selfishmisery
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I love how Catwoman ends when Human Target begins in a Burton/Donnerverse shared reality.
I guess I can wipe Human Target off the Non-Arrowverse timeline thread.
Any chance Rick Springfield's "Christopher Chance" aged up to become Lee Majors' "Christopher Chance" in the 2010 show's 1st season finale?
I guess I can wipe Human Target off the Non-Arrowverse timeline thread.
Any chance Rick Springfield's "Christopher Chance" aged up to become Lee Majors' "Christopher Chance" in the 2010 show's 1st season finale?
ItzStitch626
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Flash and crisis has made everything so confusing. Shows and movies that were once not apart of the arrowverse have become a part of it. Well canon adjacent ig
Pro Bot
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That was a very interesting coincidence. Catwoman's little "I can be gooood" narration at the end of her film taking place the same day that Chance eliminates the suicide bomber is one of the random accidental details that can occur in these timelines.
Of course! It's just that it's not made clear in the show that that's the intent so I'm not including it, but since "Christopher Chance" is a legacy character, technically yes. There's only an 11 year difference between Rick and Lee's Chance.
