Ultimate Colossus

Patriot said:
but seriously why does no publisher except Wildstorm have the balls to have a prominent(or even existent)homosexual couple?
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There was a prominent Gay couple in Vertigo Comic's The Sandman (Alexander Burgess and Paul) who appeared in the first and last arcs. Also the dead schoolboys, Paine and the other one (cant remember his name), were pretty well indicated to be gay (they walked off hand in hand). They're actually going to star in the new Vertigo Comic, Dead Boy Detectives. Then there's the Lesbian couple all over The Sandman and Death... (Foxglove and Hazel).... and also the Lesbian couples speckled all around Y: the Last Man....

Then in the formal DC universe there's the former Flash Rogue, the Pied Piper, who had a long-term boyfriend, both of whom were close friends of Wally and Linda West. And Kyle Rayner (the Green Lantern) had a Gay teenaged assistant, Terry, who got beat almost to death, and his parents blamed his boyfriend. And I mean, we all know that Robin is trying to get into Superboy's pants. Its just a matter of time.

Im guessing you meant Apollo/Midnighter from Wildstorm... yeah.

The closest Marvel has is Northstar... who is now a Zombie ninja... and The Rawhide Kid.... who is the most insulting stereotypical Gay Character I have ever read... I mean... he makes Jack from Will and Grace look like a non-stereotypical person. And the kid only Alluded to being gay, no boys kissing, or even the statement that he was attracted to men... God.. that pissed me off.

Its weird, DC, the more corporate label, is the more progressive when it comes to social issues. The only place Marvel beats it is with strong Black Characters like Luke Cage, and the Black Panther. DC had that line of comics with Static Shock.... and then there was Steel... and John Stewart as a Green Lantern.... but i mean, yeah.

Marvel needs to get some balls and let a gay couple hook up in a major title.
 
hmmm.... looking further into this, i found that Marvel has two Gay superhero couples, who were members of the Invaders during WWII (The Invaders wasnt a comic until the 70's though). Union Jack II, and Destroyer.... their relationship wasnt anything more than implications until they revisted the characters in Citizen V.

And there is Vivisector and Phat from X-Force/Statix.... but their on and off relationship faded into the background faded before the comic was cancelled.

The Gay League has a comprehensive listing of all Gay Characters in mainstream comics ->http://www.gayleague.com/gay/characters/index.php
 
Dr.Strangefate said:
And there is Vivisector and Phat from X-Force/Statix.... but their on and off relationship faded into the background faded before the comic was cancelled.
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They specifically stated the relationship wasn't sexual they just "identified with each other". Mostly as tokens. At least one of them had a thing for El Guapo but he blew himself up on a landmine or something and died. Vivisector was vaguely paired off in the arc about his "cure" but nothing came of it since they both died when X-statix ended.
 
Caduceus said:
Welcome to Marvel Goody. Gay characters don't get boyfriends, unless they're getting blown up.
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Well, then there would be no reason to make them gay them, right? I am going to challenge Vaughan on this one...
 
Young Avengers has given some suddle hints that Hulking and Asgardian might be a little more than friends. In the letters page, the respondent said that to watch out for something like that and it would add to the diversity of the group. That'd be interesting.
 
Goodwill said:
Well, then there would be no reason to make them gay them, right? I am going to challenge Vaughan on this one...
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They make them gay because they're tokens. Its the same reason when gay characters do show up, they're usually stereotypical and either boring or only entertaining in the sense that they sit there and make *****y remarks.

Vaughn may do it, or he may try but I'm still not sure Marvel will allow it. I remember one of Orson Scott Card's arguments against allowing homosexual marriage on television was basically "People will show gay marriage as being happy and good whereas heterosexual marriage is often shown as full of problems. This will make gay marriage seem good and straight marriage seem bad".
 
Caduceus said:
I remember one of Orson Scott Card's arguments against allowing homosexual marriage on television was basically "People will show gay marriage as being happy and good whereas heterosexual marriage is often shown as full of problems. This will make gay marriage seem good and straight marriage seem bad".
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Is it bad that I can see where he's coming from?
 
Patriot said:
Is it bad that I can see where he's coming from?
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Naw...I can see it too. It's a little alarmist but it's a reasonable point.
 
Patriot said:
Is it bad that I can see where he's coming from?
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No its not. Not depicting the problems in gay marriage is as stupid as not depicting problems in straight marriage.
 
I absolutely agree with Card, to be honest. I think that a lot of what is being said about marriages right now is the domestic conflicts that happen between a man and a woman. It makes a lot of sense, though, when he says that gay marriages will be put in a positive light, but a lot of the time they are more successful than the straight marriages. It's an argument worth having, but I'm siding with Card to avoid one on here.

Now, as for Colossus... I do believe he should be allowed a boyfriend if he's gay, if he's not going to shack up with someone, just make him straight... There'd be no difference, anyway.
 
Goodwill said:
Now, as for Colossus... I do believe he should be allowed a boyfriend if he's gay, if he's not going to shack up with someone, just make him straight... There'd be no difference, anyway.
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But there would be a difference. And there is. It's how he behaves around others with his secret. What he does to try and hide it because he doesn't want others to know.
 
Except if the girls wanted to go shopping :D

Honestly,I think it would do a lot for Marvel and comics in general fi he got together with another prominent X-Man.
 
Goodwill said:
Now, as for Colossus... I do believe he should be allowed a boyfriend if he's gay, if he's not going to shack up with someone, just make him straight... There'd be no difference, anyway.
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That's just ridiculous. He's already gay. It's who he is. It'd be such a copout if he doesn't get a boyfriend (which I really don't think is going to happen for a very...very... long time) to just snap your fingers and make him straight that would piss off more people than then when they made him gay to begin with. He's gay, he's gay. That's all there is too it.
 
I could come up with a very easy story that would explain why Colossus has emotionally bottled himself up, MwoF. Although there have been stories surrounding his sexuality, with what we have, something could be done very easily to make him straight again.
 
Goodwill said:
I could come up with a very easy story that would explain why Colossus has emotionally bottled himself up, MwoF. Although there have been stories surrounding his sexuality, with what we have, something could be done very easily to make him straight again.
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Goodz, I know you want to make him straight. I know for a fact that you do. But there would be a huge uproar from the fans if they ever did that. Not just with me... and I don't care if he's straight or gay but he's gay... but they said he was already gay, the fans love the fact that he's gay, and they're going to keep him gay, and explore that. If you were the writer you could do whatever you wanted with the character but Vaughan/Singer/Millar/Bendis whoever's on the title is not going to take away one of the most interesting ultimate aspects of this universe.
 
Its also the politics of the thing. Colossus is the Northstar of the Ultimate Universe, the token gay character. You not only take him away but you actually retcon him back to heterosexuality you can't send any clearer message to the gay community.
 
So, we're just going to have a homosexual character standing around in our title? I mean, in a relationship, gay or straight, there's depth there that is a very complex thing, without something like that how can sexuality truly be a thing to bank character on? I, for one, believe that it's not entirely worth Marvel's time to dub him gay when he does not act as he is... I'm not saying he's got to jump around flambouyantly, but, if his homosexuality is going to be something that defines his character, you better do something with his preference or he's just as good as straight.
 
I'm in no way disagreeing with you but Marvel's probably aware of it the same way you are, although looking at it in a totally different way.

Millar (I hope it was Millar, my brain is rotting) created a gay character to give the team "diversity". Specifically for that purpose. He's a token, just like in some ways Storm is the token black character. When a character is the only one of a particular type, they're always a token to one degree or another. Until he actually gets a boyfriend he's a token, a vague friendly gesture in the general direction of the gay community saying "See? We like gay people's money as much as we like straight people's money." They aren't creating a fully fleshed out character who's sexuality is just another aspect, they're making a token gesture. There's no meat behind it and there's no real point, I'd say.
 
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