Heroes Season 3 (Spoilers)

I though the Kensei arc was the best in season 2. The only problem as Bass said the major stuff happened early. I would have loved to have scene more stories of the adventures of Hiro and Kensei. The only problem is that after a few episodes you only a scene or two talking about their adventures off screen. This is something they could have easily extended and had a lot more fun with it. But instead they decided to focus more on Claire retarded story of a social life and Peter's arc which was just down right stupid. And the HRG arc had good premise but ultimately went no where.

Hiro's arc is the best one of season 2, it had a great story that actually ended in a cool way. The only thing holding it back besides what I mentioned above is Peter being stupid and preventing a last climatic fight between them.
 
I agree Random, but I think HRG was better than you give it credit for. And that Nathan and the 'company killings' was genuinely exciting.

The thing about season 2 is... people claim it was slow but... okay, season 2 is like a slow, country drive, that builds to a pretty nice scenic destination. The whole journey is carefully plotted. Season 3, on the other hand, is just doing loud, noisy, donuts on a racetrack, claiming it's going 100 miles an hour to Awesomeville. At least season 2 was going somewhere and stuff happened. Season 3... nothing's happened for several weeks. It's as if the whole SHOW is Peter Petrelli with amnesia (and one of the characters actually DOES have amensia). It's so full of bull****.

Blargh. I've said all I can say. We're just arguing about when Heroes jumped the shark and whether we should have hope for season 4. You guys seem to think season 2. I say season 3. You guys think it might get back to being good again, and I say that one writer won't fix it. If, say, Tim Kring had gone and was now returning, I'd be more excited because his name is all over the place. But, Fuller? Sure, he might be a great writer, but he's not the one in charge who gets to say where the show is going. It's down to Kring. And if Kring thought all the rubbish we've been getting was 'good'... I just don't think Loeb was the major problem (maybe he was) and I don't think Fuller was the major good-thing (maybe he was).

Some of us will see.

(I say some of us, because I'm having a hard enough time watching this show just to bash it.)
 
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I will also say that Hiro staying in the past and using tiny scrolls hidden in the sword for hundreds of years to communicate with Ando in the future was possibly the most retarded thing the show has ever done. He can move through time at will. There was absolutely no explanation as to why he couldn't just tell Kensei he had to go to the bathroom, catch up with Ando for a few hours, then come back to the same second. This was treated as some sort of obstacle. It's probably the worst case of "use your powers for this, dummy!" the show's done so far.

And the exact kind of thing you typically tear apart, Bass.
 
I agree Random, but I think HRG was better than you give it credit for. And that Nathan and the 'company killings' was genuinely exciting.
Well the HRG started good, I loved the premise of them finding the last 8 Isaac paintings. That's a great set up for something either really big for the finally or for the start of season 4. But instead it lead up to HRG's death, which would be fine in my book if that wasn't the finale painting. The idea the HRG sees his death but has no way to alter it. But it gets immediately retcon in the SAME EPISODE. Making the whole thing pointless. Plus it got bogged down with Claire's stupid and annoying arc as well as Mohinder's pointless switching sides the this company which is little more than a club at this point.

As for the company killings, again a great premise that fell apart. We finally get to see the original heroes and the founder of this supposedly bad *** secret organizations, really turned out to be quite lame and very anti-climatic. It really could have been more. And as for Nathan's arc, I honest can't remember what he did, though I'm certain it was good since Nathan has always been a great character.

I will also say that Hiro staying in the past and using tiny scrolls hidden in the sword for hundreds of years to communicate with Ando in the future was possibly the most retarded thing the show has ever done. He can move through time at will. There was absolutely no explanation as to why he couldn't just tell Kensei he had to go to the bathroom, catch up with Ando for a few hours, then come back to the same second. This was treated as some sort of obstacle. It's probably the worst case of "use your powers for this, dummy!" the show's done so far.

And the exact kind of thing you typically tear apart, Bass.
Really that's not something to complain about, it was a cool structure for telling Hiro's story and gave Ando something to do. Also if you ever seen Back to the future 2 you could suggest that if Hiro left the timeline would ahve assumed he didn't comeback making the future he comes toaltered because if it. Also as I just recalled Hiro was going to leave earlier but opted to stay cause he fell in love with the chick. He was probably considering spending the rest of his life with her.
 
I don't think Heroes jumped the shark in season 2, it was still good television... Season two was just when it went from one of my favorite shows on television to just another series that i watched every week... It had lots and lots of problems, the build-up was all wrong, and while the last few episodes were legitimately very good, it got there in such a mind-numbingly ridiculous way that I had stopped caring as much about the characters. It wasn't all bad, and it was MUCH better than this. But Season One is so much better, from its execution, to the very development of the characters.

I'm definitely with Planet-Man with the "Scrolls"... I ****ing hated that. It was easy and they needed something to tie it to the present because everyone was rightly thinking "Why should I care about ANY of this???". It was repetitive and only worthwhile once we found out who Adam Monroe was. Not to mention that the "Lovable sidekick becomes the man he idolized, when his idol doesn't live up to his legend" is a bit cliched... Hiro stopped acting lovable in that storyline. He just acted like an idiot and was like "KENSEI YOU ARE A GREAT HERO EVEN THOUGH YOU ARE VERY CLEARLY AN IDIOT, BUT I CANNOT SEE YOUR FAULTS BECAUSE I TOTES LUV YOU FOREVER!" for over half a season! And he failed at making him a hero! He totally failed! In season one, with the dark future Hiro we were struck with "Holy ****, Hiro is going to be totally badass" and he WAS totally badass... And then he went back to being a naive little chump, because they didn't know how to progress the character.

I really don't see what you guys loved about that storyline. Adam Monroe was good, sure, I want more Adam Monroe (and you KNOW they'll figure out how to bring him back).... but the ****ed up at trying to tell that story properly. They reaaaaaallly ****ed up.
 
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I don't think Heroes jumped the shark in season 2, it was still good television... Season two was just when it went from one of my favorite shows on television to just another series that i watched every week... It had lots and lots of problems, the build-up was all wrong, and while the last few episodes were legitimately very good, it got there in such a mind-numbingly ridiculous way that I had stopped caring as much about the characters. It wasn't all bad, and it was MUCH better than this. But Season One is so much better, from its execution, to the very development of the characters.
I agree, season 2 ruined it for me. I stopped caring about the characters. I couldn't even care enough to watch season 3
I'm definitely with Planet-Man with the "Scrolls"... I ****ing hated that. It was easy and they needed something to tie it to the present because everyone was rightly thinking "Why should I care about ANY of this???". It was repetitive and only worthwhile once we found out who Adam Monroe was. Not to mention that the "Lovable sidekick becomes the man he idolized, when his idol doesn't live up to his legend" is a bit cliched... Hiro stopped acting lovable in that storyline. He just acted like an idiot and was like "KENSEI YOU ARE A GREAT HERO EVEN THOUGH YOU ARE VERY CLEARLY AN IDIOT, BUT I CANNOT SEE YOUR FAULTS BECAUSE I TOTES LUV YOU FOREVER!" for over half a season! And he failed at making him a hero! He totally failed! In season one, with the dark future Hiro we were struck with "Holy ****, Hiro is going to be totally badass" and he WAS totally badass... And then he went back to being a naive little chump, because they didn't know how to progress the character.

I really don't see what you guys loved about that storyline. Adam Monroe was good, sure, I want more Adam Monroe (and you KNOW they'll figure out how to bring him back).... but the ****ed up at trying to tell that story properly. They reaaaaaallly ****ed up.

It was a great, and the most solid storyline of season 2. I mean yes Hiro became more bad *** at the end of season 1, but it's pretty logical for him to go back to acting like a child once he basically enters his childhood stories, and becomes a side kick to he's favorite hero. And the stgory of it was great, Hiro sets out to turn this drunk into the great hero he heard in stories, and he succeeds until there's a betrayal. And this great hero becomes on of the world's greatest villains. So Hiro must step up and fight a person he's admired since childhood. As I said the only problem with the Japan scenes were that they dragged on, when we should have been seeing each step of Adam growing and progressing into Kensei, before he tragic twist. It is the best storyline in season 2 that only suffered the same thing all the storylines suffered, pointless fillers and a quick ending.
 
I will also say that Hiro staying in the past and using tiny scrolls hidden in the sword for hundreds of years to communicate with Ando in the future was possibly the most retarded thing the show has ever done. He can move through time at will. There was absolutely no explanation as to why he couldn't just tell Kensei he had to go to the bathroom, catch up with Ando for a few hours, then come back to the same second. This was treated as some sort of obstacle. It's probably the worst case of "use your powers for this, dummy!" the show's done so far.

And the exact kind of thing you typically tear apart, Bass.

Good point. I had not considered this.

Generally, if one is really enjoying a story, the plot holes are pretty much overlooked.

To put it another way - I was enjoying Hiro's story so much I didn't care/notice plot holes.
 
Good point. I had not considered this.

Generally, if one is really enjoying a story, the plot holes are pretty much overlooked.

To put it another way - I was enjoying Hiro's story so much I didn't care/notice plot holes.

Agreed. But this is exactly why I like Season 3. It's been really exciting and fun :).
 
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Blah Blah Blah.

I agree with your guerrilla warfare idea for a season. I also like him having some super-powered Generals. Or maybe somehow The Company put him in power.

I like better that Samedi locked up the Haitian as being the one person that could stop him. Somehow all the Heroes becomes involved.

Sylar would not be in the season for the majority. When he does show up, he tries to steal his powers and fails, also gets captured.

In the final battle, while the Heroes are battling an army, Peter frees The Haitian. They also accidentally free Sylar, who gets away cause The Haitian is blocking both Peter and Sylar's powers.

The Heroes are defeating the army but can't stop Samedi, The Haitian starts fighting him and causes him to lose his powers. Samedi defeats The Haitian in hand to hand combat, while the other Heroes are busy elsewhere. He knocks him unconsciousness and decides to kill him, flashback to somewhere in the season where Samedi promised his mother that he would always take care of his brother, thus why he isn't dead.

Noah and Peter attempt to battle Samedi and they use a temporary formula designed by Mohinder to lose powers. They chain them up but are attacked by Sylar. Sylar starts to kill Samedi to take his power, thus becoming invincible. Some of the other Heroes have showed up by than. Nathan flies and grabs Samedi before Sylar can finish. Leaving Peter and Sylar to fight some more.

While Nathan is flying Samedi powers return he starts to struggle with Nathan, breaks out of his half attached chains, and causes Nathan to drop him. Samedi survives the fall of course as he regains his balance, Nathan rushes him and wraps him with the chains (maybe Daphne would do it faster, if she was in this season). He thans flies and drops him into a volcano, where he won't die, but won't be able to get free.









Now for the few things I did like in the last episode as it has become to many things to list what I hate...


- Noah hunting a non-powered Sylar and Elle. They are afraid of this guy cause he could **** them up.

- Noah slitting Sylar's throat, that was badass even if I knew it wouldn't last.

- The entire scene at the Bennet house. Sylar may not be a Peterilli, that is the greatest news in the history of ever. Hiro appears, "Bad Man". Classic Heroes. I would rate that as one of the best moments of the show.

- Hiro has never really met Clarie, I think I forgot about this. Taking her to when she was a baby and he was there. I don't know what this has to do with anything, but it was a nice scene.


- I started to like the Sylar and Elle pairing, but as Bass pointed out, they flop back and forth every 5 minutes. Are we villains trying to be redeemed or save the world for the bigger picture or are we embracing our bad. Elle am I acouraging bad Sylar or good Sylar? Ugh. Than they kill her. What A WASTE.
 
No discussion on the latest episode?

I thought it was pretty good. Sylar had some ****ing brilliant moments, like the "Cake?" scene, the bit in the elevator and the bit with Arthur.

AND HIRO IS POWERLESS!!!!
 
Usually I do this the night of to get it out of the way, but this episode warranted special consideration, seeing as it was actually pretty good. Great, even. Best Heroes episode in a long time, since Season 1, I'd say.

But, as always, the bad first. I really, really wish Elle would come back. Of course, her body has burned, as if the writers are saying, "She's definitely, definitely dead, don't bother wishing she would return!" Which boggles my mind, as she was an extremely interesting character, easily better than boring Mohinder - and yet they don't kill him off! Why? What possible reason could they have for keeping him around? To play the doctor? Just have it be a random guy in a lab coat, it'll have the same effect without being as annoying, because you'd expect a minor character to be so utterly devoid of personality and substance.

But I digress. Sylar was incredibly badass througout the entire episode, and I decided about halfway through to just pretend his entire "arc" through the rest of the season didn't happen. It's easier to enjoy the episode if you stop thinking about how utterly pointless his entire story this season really was.

On another sour note ... Hiro's storyline had good and bad moments. The good was everything before Arthur showed up; his reunion with his mother, though a tad implausible ("Hey, aren't you the chef?" "No, I'm your son!" "Oh, okay!"), was incredibly touching, and Masi Okoa proved why he was nominated for an Emmy in season one, when his character wasn't a) trapped in Feudal Japan doing essentially the same thing over and over again or b) ten years old. It was a great moment.

Of course, then Arthur, who, with everything else, has the amazing ability to be exactly where he's needed to push the plot forward and create complications, had to go and render everything that just happened completely pointless. Seriously, not ten minutes ago, he was tearfully assuring his mother, in a very heartfelt moment, that he had grown up, and was not just "powerful" enough, but strong enough emotionally, to take care of the catalyst. And then Arthur shows up and effectively renders her sacrifice moot (I also think it's interesting that the writers keep finding ways to make Hiro inaccessible; he knows too much, so they first make him ten years old, and then strand him back in time. It feels like season two all over again, only instead of being trapped in Feudal Japan for half a season, he's been rendered completely useless for half a season).

Regardless, it was a good episode. It's interesting to know that the Haitian's abilities aren't as all-powerful as we have been led to believe, which it good because you never want an all-powerful character running around who's basically a walking plot hole (*cough*PETER*cough*ARTHUR*cough*). And Sylar being the one to kill Arthur? Almost totally makes his entire ridiculous storyline worth it.

Also, am I the only one who really, really wants Peter to stay powerless? He's much, much more interesting this way. He actually has motivation, and has to make difficult decisions, and what's more, his every stupid action doesn't have the question of "well why didn't he just use his powers?!"

All in all, a great episode. I know that I make it sound like there's more bad than good, but I suppose that's because I have the tendency to rant about things I don't like. Really, most of the stuff in this ep was solid, and entertaining. I liked it.
 
Meh.

It was pretty good.

There's still some stupid, and most of the complaints are levied at previous episodes... but this one wasn't 'great'. Was good though. But it being good actually just proves how annoying the previous episodes were.

It feels like "Season 3 didn't happen" is going to be a new rule.

First up - why didn't Sylar just nuke Elle's body?

Think about. Sylar is somewhere. He doesn't know where. Elle shows up. It's night and they're on a beach. He then kills her. He wants to get rid of the body/pay his respects. He waits SEVERAL HOURS (it was dark, now it's sunny) and finds a can of lighter fluid. I assume those hours were spent looking for said can of lighter fluid.

Why doesn't he just use Ted's powers to burn her? Or Elle's? Remember, Elle burned someone in her first appearance (the cool Irish guy). There's no need for the lighter fluid.

To be honest though... it's not a deal breaker. It's just a little silly.

Anyhow, some silly things. Hiro having amnesia. The whole emotional point of the scenes is that Hiro meets his dead mother and is all tearful about it. Yet, his dead dad doesn't rate because he's got no memories. His dead dad reunion was one of the best things in season 2. Hiro having amnesia just prevented that added emotion.

And not only that, but there's no point at all for Hiro's amnesia.

Hiro has no amnesia, what does he do after the African? He goes back in time to get the catalyst. He gets the catalyst. Papa Petrelli shows up. Gets catalyst. Strands Hiro. Angela knows "he won" because he has the catalyst and thus the formula. Oh, and there's a goddam phone in Pinehearst. He can just call her. Claire in the past does nothing.

Also, there's another problem: What was the 'special thing' Sylar saw in Claire? Was it the catalyst? If so... Hiro has changed the past. Something he can't do. There was a time travel rule in Heroes. You can't change the past, but you can change the future. This made sense, both logically and creatively, as it solved a lot of inherent problems of a time traveller. The problem here is that, yes, Claire could, in hindsight, never have had the catalyst, but that just brings up what Sylar saw. I dunno.

I'm also annoyed, kinda, that Hiro's mum had powers. I wonder if Adam purposely introduced special people to each other to mate and breed powerful offspring.

Speaking of things that didn't matter (we shall call them "Eclipses" or... "Wastes of time") - Sylar. Now he's bad. With the line, "I almost forgot how good this feels" Sylar was back. And then they kinda did the cake and elevator scenes as dark humour which was okay.

But here's the thing; yes. It is cool that Sylar is a scary mass-murderer again (kinda - like I care Sue Landers, who everyone in the office called "Sam" died), it just makes me irate. First of all, Sylar is back to being 'evil' again, killing people for their powers (or revenge)... which is something he was at the beginning of the season. Sylar didn't need to have a reason to kill Arthur Petrelli. He already had one.

Arthur Petrelli is going to give the world super powers. This will make everyone special. This will make Sylar not special. Sylar upset. Sylar goes and kills Papa Petrelli to retain his position on top of the food chain.

No need for the bull**** of Sylar being a Petrelli or a good guy.

Mama Petrelli fed Sylar a woman (whose power has yet to come up) to get him to go kill Arthur. The Petrelli thing doesn't need to be there. She just feeds him and sends him on his way. He already has motivation to kill Papa Petrelli.

Oh, and the whole "I almost forgot how good this feels" brings up the "hunger" bull****. Sylar was enjoys killing people. The hunger doesn't matter. It was invented to give him a reason to be good. Which was unnecessary.

Also, I bet you any amount of money, Sylar was supposed to be a Petrelli. I reckon, when it was revealed, the backlash caused them to rewrite it back out. The reason? The way Sylar got Elle's power. It's Peter's power. How does Sylar possess it at all? And how on Earth did Papa Petrelli know that Mama Petrelli had lied to Sylar? That man must have mad improvisational skills. And why would he lie to Sylar? He doesn't need to. He can just steal his powers and kill him.

Sylar was retconned twice, in one season.

And speaking of Papa Petrelli - how does the bullet death work? The Eclipse removes powers; Sylar and Claire die. The Eclipse passes, they come back to life. Now, the only time this is different is if something is lodged in the brain. This is the kill shot. Their eyes go white, and so on.

Except... the bullet went through Papa Petrelli's head. And his eyes didn't go white.

As soon as the Haitian leaves... Papa Petrelli regenerates.

And Papa Petrelli is a jerk. He just wins when the writers want him too.

How did he know Hiro was 1992? HOW HOW HOW?! And how could Hiro not teleport with Claire to somewhere else? Last episode, when he thought he was ten years old, he took out Sylar and Elle, and then Claire. This episode, with his post-Kensei bad-assery, Hiro is ****ing USELESS.

I can't take a show seriously when the writers have their characters work at the speed of plot. There's no ****ing consistency.

Like, out of the blue, the Haitian has to actively turn off people's powers. Which he's never needed to do before. Not only that, but in THIS SEASON,he turned off Daphne's and Hiro's powers without realising they were even in the building.

They just came up with that for two reasons; 1) To add "drama" to Peter killing Papa Petrelli, and by "drama", I mean a ticking clock because they wanted Peter to stand around and look cross for five minutes. They dragged out that scene. And you know what? Where was Knox? Where was Flint? *sigh* 2) So Sylar could kill Arthur Petrelli in a cool tk fashion, and set up so next week, Sylar can kill the Haitian.

Here's the thing; first, to add 'drama' to the scene, when Peter shows up to kill his father, he's with Knox and Flint. Haitian turns off their powers, and a brawl ensues. And two, Peter kills his dad in cold blood. **** Sylar.

But here's a better way: the whole Peter/Arthur resolution is only possible because of the Haitian because Athur has no powers.

WHAT ABOUT THE DAMNED ECLIPSE? Why didn't the writers, when they came up with the idea of the eclipse, write in the scenes where Angela is aware of the eclipse and sends Peter off to kill Arthur while the eclipse is on.

There's your ****ing ticking clock you jackasses.

Imagine, instead of the Haitian sweating, the SUN is coming out and Peter has to decide now.

The Eclipse now has a purpose. A ****ty one, but something happens.

OH! And one more thing; Arthur Petrelli is convinced that the apocalypse Peter saw is a matter of perspective. "In your opinion, Peter." Papa Petrelli can travel to the future.

WHY DON'T THEY GO TO THE FUTURE TOGETHER AND WORK THIS **** OUT.

:arrgh:

AND ANOTHER THING! The Haitian is in the building. Why don't Mohinder's scabs stop? Wouldn't it have been funny as hell if Mohinder gave the serum to Steve Rogers and because of the Haitian... nothing happened? That would make sense.

But none of this has been thought out.

The messenger has a sketch book that fan boys have been asking about for ages. Why is it not on ebay?!?!?!?! He should've ****ing sold it by now. It's been a YEAR. He's skimming money off the top. He'd've put it on ebay and ****ing sold it as soon as he realised people were really desperate for it.

And **** you, Daphne, Matt, and Ando. How long did you spend on the ****ing cover to that comic? Comics take no time to read. Stop the ****-teasing.

Oh, and the marine heroes... did they choose to give him super strength or not? And... I could care less. The Ultimates, this is not.

So, yes, this was a pretty good episode. Masi Oka and Zachary Quinto were particularly great.

But it just isn't thought out. It's inconsistent and very little actually matters. All this episode had was two good acting scenes and a major death of a **** character.

Case in point: if Hiro hadn't lost his powers in episode 7, this would've been episode 8.

4 weeks of bull**** for no reason.

I won't be happy until, instead of going "Previously on Heroes", the show opens with Tim Kring going, "Hi. Sorry, but Heroes has been **** for a while and we really ****ed up. We're going to rectify that now. Sorry we ****ed up. Here is your time back."

Or until they do something awesome.

Of course, then Arthur, who, with everything else, has the amazing ability to be exactly where he's needed to push the plot forward and create complications, had to go and render everything that just happened completely pointless. Seriously, not ten minutes ago, he was tearfully assuring his mother, in a very heartfelt moment, that he had grown up, and was not just "powerful" enough, but strong enough emotionally, to take care of the catalyst. And then Arthur shows up and effectively renders her sacrifice moot (I also think it's interesting that the writers keep finding ways to make Hiro inaccessible; he knows too much, so they first make him ten years old, and then strand him back in time. It feels like season two all over again, only instead of being trapped in Feudal Japan for half a season, he's been rendered completely useless for half a season).

Hiro and Peter suffer from "Writers aren't smart enough to write me" syndrome.

Also, am I the only one who really, really wants Peter to stay powerless? He's much, much more interesting this way. He actually has motivation, and has to make difficult decisions, and what's more, his every stupid action doesn't have the question of "well why didn't he just use his powers?!"

As I have been saying since season 1. Peter without powers is more interesting. Hiro without powers is not.
 

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