Why I Hate Superman

The Overlord said:
The problem is with Superman's senses and x-ray vision and super sped, he should be able to capture Toyman before he could threaten anyone, it would take a lot of PIS to buy Superman having problems doing so.



That show wasn't very good though, it kinda sucked.

STAS was way better, where Superman was les powerful and the villains were way more dangerous.
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But the problem lies in all honesty with the fans.

Especially the older fans, who want the planet-moving, slows down for the Flash, Superman. Not the more realistically powered, and more enjoyable Superman.
 
The Overlord said:
The problem is with Superman's senses and x-ray vision and super sped, he should be able to capture Toyman before he could threaten anyone, it would take a lot of PIS to buy Superman having problems doing so.

Plus Superman fighting a child killer, is jarring, Superman should not fight that kinda villain.
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Toyman only killed one child, and I believe it was an accident. And what should he do, let people kill children? That doesn't make sense.

Superman's X-ray vision has limits (like he can't see through lead), and it would be a little invasive of him to go around at super speed checking everyone's home and business to find one person.
 
The Overlord said:
That show wasn't very good though, it kinda sucked.

STAS was way better, where Superman was less powerful and the villains were way more dangerous.
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What does this have to do with the issue though? Whether or not you liked those shows, they're still examples of Superman having hundreds of different, well thought-out, non-Kryptonite/magic/strength based obstacles.

That what the problem with Superman Returns, he didn't have a villain that pose a physical threat (and movie Lex barely counted as a mental threat either.)

As seen with superman Returns, superman just saving people over and over again, gets kinda boring.

To extent a hero is defined by his or her villains, the villains should pose a threat to the hero, without the hero relying Plot induced stupidity for the story to last more three panels.
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Again, this is all COMPLETELY an issue of ****ty writing and nothing to do with the character himself, let alone his personality or moral code, which is what the article was lambasting so ignorantly.

I've yet to see a single point made in this thread or the article that actually points out a fundamental flaw in the character and not just examples of particularly poorly written material based on him or excellently written material based on Batman or somebody, as if that has anything to do with anything.
 
Joe Kalicki said:
Toyman only killed one child, and I believe it was an accident. And what should he do, let people kill children? That doesn't make sense.

Superman's X-ray vision has limits (like he can't see through lead), and it would be a little invasive of him to go around at super speed checking everyone's home and business to find one person.
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So privacy is more important than stopping a child killer?!

Sorry billy died, but hey, I respect your privacy.

Your not reading what I'm saying, Superman should not let Toyman kill a child, period.

Superman has super speed, super hearing and X-ray vision, he should be able to scan the city a hundred times and find evil toy factory Toyman is hiding 3 minutes after Toyman escaped. If DD can find people with his super senses to find villains, why Superman think that more often?

Toyman as continuing villain at all, makes Superman look stupid, it takes insane amount of plot induced stupidity for Toyman to work as villain at all.

Planet-man said:
What does this have to do with the issue though? Whether or not you liked those shows, they're still examples of Superman having hundreds of different, well thought-out, non-Kryptonite/magic/strength based obstacles.
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But their not good examples of story telling in general, so its not a good example to use as potential stories that could be used.

That series just didn't age well and was ultimately pretty boring overall, so their not good examples of superman dealing with villains who couldn't pose a phsyical threat.

I mean that show had its moments, but its certainly not a consitantly good example of good superman stories, a lot of them were crap.

So that's bad example, not a good way, because often the stories weren't well thought out.

Planet-man said:
Again, this is all COMPLETELY an issue of ****ty writing and nothing to do with the character himself, let alone his personality or moral code, which is what the article was lambasting so ignorantly.

I've yet to see a single point made in this thread or the article that actually points out a fundamental flaw in the character and not just examples of particularly poorly written material based on him or excellently written material based on Batman or somebody, as if that has anything to do with anything.
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I'm not criticizing the character, just the way he is written some times.

Superman's character is fine, its when the writers make him so powerful he outclasses his villains and has to written as idiot for the story to last more than 3 panels, than the character is done a disservice. Then Superman just becomes a fan wank character, which is bad.

Superman should powerful, but his villains should match him as well.
 
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The Overlord said:
So privacy is more important than stopping a child killer?!

Sorry billy died, but hey, I respect your privacy.

Your not reading what I'm saying, Superman should not let Toyman kill a child, period.

Superman has super speed, super hearing and X-ray vision, he should be able to scan the city a hundred times and find evil toy factory Toyman is hiding 3 minutes after Toyman escaped. If DD can find people with his super senses to find villains, why Superman think that more often?

Toyman as continuing villain at all, makes Superman look stupid, it takes insane amount of plot induced stupidity for Toyman to work as villain at all.
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You're wrong. So is that article. I'll tell you all why once I drink some Imagination Juice.
 
Zombipanda said:
You're wrong. So is that article. I'll tell you all why once I drink some Imagination Juice.
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I like Superman, I just don't like when he suffers from large amounts of plot induced stupidity in order to move the story forward. That just does a disservice to the character.
 
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Supes is a great character. The problem is he goes from being a force of nature who is moving planets to being shot down in mid superspeed flight by Dr. Light depending on the situation. I just wish it would be consistant. Powering him down a bit makes for a more compelling character (IMO) since he can actually be threatened. When he is so powerful it makes it hard to come up with villains who can match that.
 
marvelman said:
dude, he burned out the part of the brain with his lazer vision that gave them their powers. that, to me, counts as a lobotomy.
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Didn't he lobotomize Manchester Black like that in one story? Is that the one you're talking about?

The only two problems I have with Superman are his powers and the way his secret identity is handled. He does have too many powers in my opinion. And he's got too many ******* visions - X-ray, heat, microscopic, telescopic....how the **** does he manage to see with all those ****ing eyesights?!?! He is too powerful.

I've never like how nobody can tell that Clark is Superman/vice-versa, but then again everybody seems to have that problem with him. But it is just a comic book.
 
Now it's safe to say I don't like superman, but i never bought into the whole he's too powerful schpiel. There are plenty of characters in supes class that don't seem to have that problem, the power problem is the fault of poor writers it is not a viable reason to dislike the character.

I dislike him because he feels so stale, almost sterile, I can't really explain it properly. I have the same problem with most DC characters actually, I just can't seem to be able to get interested in any of them.
 
yeah, his identity switching gets me as well. I really hated when people at my comic shop were complaining about Cap in that one issue of Civil War where all he had was a cop uniform and a moustache and how that wouldn't pass to cover his identity. My argument was how Superman just combs his damn hair and puts on some specs and he's a completely different person. So they argued that Cap's identity was public and that he was a huge figure. So I said technically so was SUpermans. They know where he's from and that he's an alien. I says to this guy, "You're going to tell me that no one is going to ever look at Clark Kent and say, Damn that guy looks JUST like Superman." Then came more technicalities. They just didn't want to let that Cap situation alone. Sometimes I hate myself for choosing this society bracket.
 
J. Agamemnon said:
yeah, his identity switching gets me as well. I really hated when people at my comic shop were complaining about Cap in that one issue of Civil War where all he had was a cop uniform and a moustache and how that wouldn't pass to cover his identity. My argument was how Superman just combs his damn hair and puts on some specs and he's a completely different person. So they argued that Cap's identity was public and that he was a huge figure. So I said technically so was SUpermans. They know where he's from and that he's an alien. I says to this guy, "You're going to tell me that no one is going to ever look at Clark Kent and say, Damn that guy looks JUST like Superman." Then came more technicalities. They just didn't want to let that Cap situation alone. Sometimes I hate myself for choosing this society bracket.
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:roll:

It's not just glasses. It's a persona. The way he stands, the way he holds his jaw, etc. His entire body changes. Not to mention, he can actually physically compress his spine so that he seems shorter.
 
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Gothamite said:
:roll:

It's not just glasses. It's a persona. The way he stands, the way he holds his jaw, etc. His entire body changes. Not to mention, he can actually physically compress his spine so that he seems shorter.
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And Cap in Civil War was acting as someone else. The public largely sees him with a cowl on his head. Take a well known actor and from time to time you can watch a movie and completely not know it was them.

Case in point, until recently I didn't know Gene Hackman was the blind guy in Young Frankenstein. And that wasn't much of a change in appearance.
 
J. Agamemnon said:
yeah, his identity switching gets me as well. I really hated when people at my comic shop were complaining about Cap in that one issue of Civil War where all he had was a cop uniform and a moustache and how that wouldn't pass to cover his identity. My argument was how Superman just combs his damn hair and puts on some specs and he's a completely different person. So they argued that Cap's identity was public and that he was a huge figure. So I said technically so was SUpermans. They know where he's from and that he's an alien. I says to this guy, "You're going to tell me that no one is going to ever look at Clark Kent and say, Damn that guy looks JUST like Superman." Then came more technicalities. They just didn't want to let that Cap situation alone. Sometimes I hate myself for choosing this society bracket.
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I think the whole glasses disguise has been "grandfathered" in.
 
Superman just slouches and what not.

But your missing the point: Lois Lane didn't believe Superman was Clark Kent. Y'know why? Because Superman is SUPERMAN. He's a superhero who can fly across the world and saves people every day. At what point in your head do you think he even HAS a secret identity? Sure, Clark Kent can look like him a little bit and people may even think that, but who in their right mind would think Clark Kent IS Superman? THAT'S unrealistic.

People love to think that it's an unrealistic idea that no one would recognize Clark as Superman, and it's fun we like to have at the concept. But that idea is based on the times in your life someone close to you has pretended to be someone else; like the kid who puts his y-fronts on his head and 'fights crime'. Of COURSE it's the same damn kid.

But do you think that the skinny nerd without glasses in the cubicle next to you is BILL GATES just because they look similar? You've never seen them together! All he's done is take off his glasses! It MUST be Bill Gates!

It's nonsense that anyone would look at a person like Superman and immediately assume he has a secret identity, let alone deduce that his secret identity is the mild-mannered idiot who keeps knocking things over.
 
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Bass said:
Superman just slouches and what not.

But your missing the point: Lois Lane didn't believe Superman was Clark Kent. Y'know why? Because Superman is SUPERMAN. He's a superhero who can fly across the world and saves people every day. At what point in your head do you think he even HAS a secret identity? Sure, Clark Kent can look like him a little bit and people may even think that, but who in their right mind would think Clark Kent IS Superman? THAT'S unrealistic.
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A very good point that only modern and Golden Age writers seem to get/have gotten. It's really annoying in the Silver Age how so many criminals/supporting characters try to find out Superman's secret identity. How can they even know he has one?!
 
It's really annoying in the Silver Age how so many criminals/supporting characters try to find out Superman's secret identity. How can they even know he has one?!
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I've never thought about that. That's interesting.
 
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