Ultimates 2 #13- Worth the Wait or not?

Ultimate 2 #13- Worth the wait or not?

  • Yes

    Votes: 27 37.0%

  • No

    Votes: 20 27.4%

  • Who Cares

    Votes: 26 35.6%
  • Total voters
    73
Lil Brother said:
It's not like Ultimates was ever really a monthly title.
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That's a complete load of bollocks.

Just because Ultimates 1 didn't follow a monthly timetable, that didn't stop the press material for it being referred to as a 'monthly'. They only stopped calling it a monthly when the frequency of delays went from 'disappointing news' to 'expected tardiness'. Thus, you can't use it as a precedent.

The fact that Ultimates 2 was re-claimed to be a monthly only makes that worse. Now if they had said that Ultimates 2 was going to be bi-monthly, quarterly, or that it'd have a planned 'three year completion schedule' then you could excuse the tardiness.

Saying that Ultimates has never followed a monthly time-table (in the face of Marvel's continuous pre-release declarations that each volume would be) as an excuse for the second volume to continue to be late is like saying it's okay for a pizza delivery service to be consistently late in spite of the promise of 'under 30 minutes'.

'30 minutes' means '30 minutes' not '30 minutes when we feel like it'. 'Monthly' means 'monthly' not 'monthly until we feel like the first volume is an excuse to change our minds about that even though it was a promotional motivation to say monthly right now'.
 
I think Lil Brother was just pointing out that even when it was claimed to be monthly, it wasn't. That's all. :)
 
I just re-read Ultimates # 11 and # 12. So with a freshly 're-informed' mind, I'd have to say no. I can't remember the last time I read so many pages of infantile garbage.

Millar is just phoning it in to the point where it feels like he doesn't care anymore. It's okay to have bad days, but at least try to look like you care.
 
Opinions vary, tastes vary, patience limits vary.

But the comic book medium is about superhero wrestling, so whoever has The Undertaker wins. By this token The Ultimates 1 and 2 did exactly what it said on the tin, just took over 5 years to do it.

Saying that a writer phoned in the story indicates you could have done better. But it also shows you still read the story.

I reads it, I likes it, I hates the delay but I'm not going to tell Millar he can't do big finales because that is incorrect. Its his raison d'etre. Thats what he does. Detail gets lost, characterisation slips but the bang per buck is the best in the industry. Marvel gives him leeway to do what he does, 2 million copies of Civil War get sold. But he did it with Spider-Man, Wolverine, Superman and the Authority before he even started on Ultimates.

Book=good
Delays=unforgivable

this is my two penn'orth.
 
I don't question your right to value the book on its own terms. If you enjoy it then that's great. But you use some really silly logic.

olavthehairy said:
Saying that a writer phoned in the story indicates you could have done better.
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No, it indicates he could have done better. It's an affirmation and belief of Millar's abilities. It has nothing to do with whether or not the reader could do better.

olavthehairy said:
But it also shows you still read the story.
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Now that's just silly. That's like saying you don't have a right to pooh-pooh a film because you sat through the whole thing in the cinema. ("You sat through the whole thing, so he must be a good filmmaker!")

Or that you can't complain about the car you own. ("You may not have known it had crappy transmission, but you paid for it, so you CAN'T complain!")

Or about a girl who was a lousy lay. ("You didn't know she'd be crap, but you shagged her didn't you, so that's gotta count for something.")
 
You stated that the story for issue 11 and 12 were inferior, correct?

In what context? Compared to what? Hawkeye's family being slaughtered?

At no point did I say you could not complain, my opinion is my opinion but I didn't stoop to calling your opinions "silly". Or go into a multi paragraphed rant about the delays being unacceptable, which has been done by hundreds of people for the last few years.

I just want to read the story.
 
olavthehairy said:
You stated that the story for issue 11 and 12 were inferior, correct?

In what context? Compared to what? Hawkeye's family being slaughtered?

At no point did I say you could not complain, my opinion is my opinion but I didn't stoop to calling your opinions "silly". Or go into a multi paragraphed rant about the delays being unacceptable, which has been done by hundreds of people for the last few years.
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I wasn't calling your opinion silly at all. I said your logic of defense was. Different things.

I must apologize though, because I guess it was an editing error on my part to call your logic silly in the same paragraph I used to say you have the right to enjoy the book. It reads like I was saying your enjoyment of the book is silly. Which it is not, and I was most certainly did intend to say either.

Yes, I said 11 and 12 were inferior. But whether I think it is inferior or whether you think it's superior or who's correct and whose not is something I don't care to dispute, because it doesn't matter. Degustibus non disputandem and all that. But my point of contention has never been about your taste, or whether it matches mine.

My point of contention was that you basically said that my having read Ultimates 2 automatically validates its worth. My point of contention was that you basically said that my saying Millar 'phoned it in' --- regardless of whether that's objectively true or not --- is saying that 'I could have done better', when it's not. I'm not naysaying that I'm the better writer, boo hoo hoo bash writer # 24601. I'm saying that Mark Millar can do better.
 
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thanks - fair and acceptable point.

I feel 11 and 12 built tension towards a climax, you may feel they trod water until the nub, some say the res, of the whole shebang. But the expression "phoning it in" really grates with me, as it signifies a lack of concious effort. Wouldn't it be true just to say "I though issues 11 and 12 were ****" instead of the implication that the writer couldn't be bothered to put his back into it?

anyway, its a great site, its a great book, and I agree the point I made about reading the issues proving a point needs to be taken outside and shot.

Olav
 
olavthehairy said:
But the expression "phoning it in" really grates with me, as it signifies a lack of concious effort. Wouldn't it be true just to say "I though issues 11 and 12 were ****" instead of the implication that the writer couldn't be bothered to put his back into it?
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Fair enough. I'm not a big fan of the expression either.
 
If I could, I would change my vote to no. After rereading 1 through 12 last night, I couldn't even bring myself to care about the story anymore. Issue 13 is definitely going to be a major letdown.
 
ultimatedjf said:
If I could, I would change my vote to no. After rereading 1 through 12 last night, I couldn't even bring myself to care about the story anymore. Issue 13 is definitely going to be a major letdown.
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Now your turn to Difficult To Please Fanboy Side is complete! MWAHAHHAHAH! I AM SUCCESSFULZ!
 
I think it's not worth the wait in story (Grand Theft America is definitely the weakest arc) but I think it'll be worth the wait because it's the end of an era.
 
ProjectX2 said:
I think it's not worth the wait in story (Grand Theft America is definitely the weakest arc) but I think it'll be worth the wait because it's the end of an era.
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If by 'end of an era' you mean to say the end of an era when there was actually something worth reading in the Ultimate line, then I agree.

Unfortunately, that means the era should've ended a long time ago when the book was SUPPOSED to come out, and coinciding roughly with when all the other books stopped being worth reading as well.
 
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