Ultimate X-Men #66 Discussion (Spoilers)

[Fuzzy Birds]

My guess is that somebody helped Sabes come back. He can't exactly reattach his own head, so I think someone else did it and waited for his healing factor to kick in.

What about if since his 'death', Sabes has assembled a new Brotherhood, full of a bunch of inept bumbling fools, as one would expect him to recruit.

 

[Hyperstorm]

While it isn't explained Sabretooth does have a giant red scar on his neck.

 

[Bass]

This was unbelievably boring.

Also, it has some of the worst exposition I've ever read, re - Kitty telling Rogue what everyone is doing just after we find out as they tell everyone their plans for the night. The conversation was boring the first time, we don't need to be told again.

But I won't dwell because, to be fair to Kirkman, that is by far, the worst part of the issue, the rest not particularly good, but definately not that bad.

Anyhow, I remember liking Tom Raney's art. I can't think why. There isn't one good panel in the entire issue.

As for the plots:

Red guy - Nothing is known. His parents are dead but we don't know why that matters. I think more of the issue should have been about him to make the "cliffhanger" actually have impact.

Lilandra and Xavier - I like the idea the Shi'ar as a church. We can tell they worship the Phoenix and they are trying to keep an eye on Jean. The idea is fine, but it is poorly executed. Why does "make it realistic" mean "make it trivial"? Lilandra reveals her name and identity. So what? Unless your an old X-Man fan, you don't get the relevance because the meaning is not apparent within the confines of this issue. I think it would've been great to have Lilandra tell all this to Charles, really impress him, by taking him to her alien ship. The super technology, the bizarre members of her Imperial Guard. Real, "My God!" moment for Charles. Instead she tells him calmly at a resteraunt. She doesn't have to be an alien. She can be more "realistic" but she should still be a ****ing Imperial Queen with a fantastic bearing. When she speaks, countries step into line. Her beauty forces nations to bow. She doesn't have to be an alien - she just has to be majestic. And she wants Charles (it seems). Realistic is one thing. Trivial is another.

Nightcrawler and Colossus - this was well done. I thought it was funny, amusing, and really, these guys are the best thing in Ultimate X-Men and have been for ages.

Wolverine and Storm - I think I've read this "sub-plot" a billion times before.

Rogue and Iceman - It's nice, but dull. Not bad, not good, just eh.

Jean and Scott - Ugh. I dunno about you, but I think Jean's a *****. It's one thing to talk telepathically, but to force people to quit smoking or say things for you - doesn't that strike you as horrifically manipulative? If she was listening into Scott and Xavier's conversation why not SAY what she wanted to say, telepathically, to both of them? Why FORCE Scott to say something for her? It's like she's pissing on him to mark her territory. No wonder he won't do things without her say so. Also, Jean states she's psychic and knows everything Scott knows. So she knows why he doesn't take the first move and she should also understand and accept, not yell and ***** to him. Jesus, she's a telepath! Why does she have to have a heart-to-heart? Personal problems like this wouldn't exist with open telepathy as Scott and Jean do. Scott seems to have no problem with her reading his mind all the time. Now, if Scott was purposefully keeping her OUT of his thoughts and not letting her in, she'd start to wonder why, and then you have conflict. Egh, I'm tired of complaining. I don't even know if I'm making sense.

But the whole issue, save Nightcrawler and Colossus, was just dull.

Jean forcing Wolvie and Scott

 

[Fuzzy Birds]

Not sure about you Bass, but I intrepreted the whole 'Jean being b*tchy' thing as Phoenix foreshadowing. Think about it, if the inevitable Ultimate Phoenix plotline is going to be anything close to monumental to our fellow mutants, and likewise if it's going to follow 616, then Jean is gonna turn nasty evil-like. I figure Kirkman knows this and is simply setting it up.

 

[TheManWithoutFear]

I think you guys are getting the full effect that this is a filler story for Singer. Bryan was supposed to come on after Vaughan. They needed people who would tell a subtle story without delving into the major storylines. "Date Night" is a lot of short stories. I really enjoyed it but there must be something wrong with me if the people I usually agree with hate it that much.

I know the Logan/Storm part was the same old song and dance. But the only reason I got pysched for it is Sabertooth, whose the living key to Wolverine's past. It's not like Deathstrike (Worst part of Vaughan's run) where we get more ties to Weapon X for the sake of action and terrible villains. It's about the personal story Wolverine will go through. I can't give Kirkman the praise for it yet but I'm hopeing he uses Sabertooth the right way.

Jean being a *****? I kind've agree. She's somehow compromised her standards lately invading everyone's thoughts freefully. I wonder why...

Rogue and Bobby. How they're drawn. Like they should be. They're kids, young ones. About it being forced, I think it was fine. They were stuck alone, have history, Rogue's unknowingly being influenced by Gambit's former sex drive (not Gambit himself), and Bobby needs a girl by his side at all times. Mix it together and you're gonna get dirty talk from little kids.

Kitty/Spider-Man? Who said there needed to be more of them? That's crazy talk. This is UXM. Be thankful he's in the title at all. And VVD thanks for agreeing. I think the relationship is nothing more than hey, we have something in common (heroes) let's date. Peter's gonna realize you can't just not love someone. But I think the best part will be Kitty's reaction after they breakup. Always *****ing about Spider-Man and how uncool she thinks he is. It'll be funny stuff.

I liked the lilandra thing. Bass, I don't know if you're saying you wanted her to be an alien or what but if that's the case I have to disagree.

Sorry guys, can't help likeing what's been done.

 

[marvelman]

ok with the guy in the mansion, i bet anything its either magician or banshee. it could go either way. here's why.

there is no furniture. what do MAGICIANS do? they make things disappear. but then what about the parents??

what is this character doing? he is calling throughout the house. what is banshee's power based around?? his voice. so what if he is accidentally using his sonic scream and his voice just knocks out his parents?? and what if that large empty room was a ball room? i think its banshee... 8)

 

[E]

Anyhow, I remember liking Tom Raney's art. I can't think why. There isn't one good panel in the entire issue.

I don't mean to sound like a dick, but Raney's art is what brought down Ultimate Secret. He's just not good.

 

[ProjectX2]

I don't mean to sound like a dick, but Raney's art is what brought down Ultimate Secret. He's just not good.

Of course.

 

[Ice]

I don't mean to sound like a dick, but Raney's art is what brought down Ultimate Secret. He's just not good.

Yeah, the transition form McNiven to him wasn't well. And his work here isn't good. I liked him better in Uncanny when he did his 2-issue stint. This is not good work now.

 

[ProjectX2]

I told you the interior art sucked. Raney's art is just so... dull.

 

[marvelman]

yeah, his uncanny stuff was... un...canny.... ugh.

and his thor stuff was exceptional too.

 

[Ice]

yeah, his uncanny stuff was... un...canny.... ugh.

and his thor stuff was exceptional too.

You are a crazy ferret. :lol:

 

[marvelman]

its my claim to fame.

8) word.8)

 

[Fuzzy Birds]

ok with the guy in the mansion, i bet anything its either magician or banshee. it could go either way. here's why.

there is no furniture. what do MAGICIANS do? they make things disappear. but then what about the parents??

what is this character doing? he is calling throughout the house. what is banshee's power based around?? his voice. so what if he is accidentally using his sonic scream and his voice just knocks out his parents?? and what if that large empty room was a ball room? i think its banshee... 8)

I noticed a few people earlier assuming this was the guy's house and that he was another little rich kid, but I seem to remember him shouting 'Where am I?'. Then again, his parents were there too, and he seemed to think they would be. My point? I don't know, I think I lost it.

And it's not Banshee. I mean, what? Did he scream all the furniture away?

 

[Ice]

Ice, that's you in the letter's page right?

Yes, sir.

 

[ProjectX2]

Yes, sir.

How many letters pages have you been printed in?

 

[DIrishB]

I'm telling ya, Mystery Guy= The Magician. I bet MWF's membership on it.

I agree.

Finally? He gets more action than almost anyone in the UU.

Quite true. Lilandra will just be another notch on his wheelchair.

While it isn't explained Sabretooth does have a giant red scar on his neck.

Good point, hadn't even noticed that. That in itself pretty much says a lot...obviously his head and body were grown back together somehow. I'm sure it'll be explained a bit next issue when Wolverine asks "Aren't you supposed to be missing a head?"


And Ice, nice job on the letter. I haven't seen that much ***-kissing since the last episode of the Tonight Show hosted by Johnny Carson (99% of it from Ed McMahon). But I completely agree with it all. You made a couple really great points with it, and I (and probably most other UXM readers) for one hope he will return to the title one day, or at least another Ultimate title. Still, I think his style is best suited for UXM.

 

[iceman]

Rogue and Bobby. How they're drawn. Like they should be. They're kids, young ones. About it being forced, I think it was fine. They were stuck alone, have history, Rogue's unknowingly being influenced by Gambit's former sex drive (not Gambit himself), and Bobby needs a girl by his side at all times. Mix it together and you're gonna get dirty talk from little kids.

Thank you! Jesus, someone agrees with me.

I'm not so sure about the Rogue/Gambit's sex drive thing, because if I couldn't touch people for a very long time, then could, I think I'd be pouncing on peoples as well.

 

[TheManWithoutFear]

He doesn't seem like a bad guy. I thought The Magician would be bad.

Ice, I enjoyed your letter too. I was only joking to bring it to the attention of the others. UXM's letter page doesn't hold a candle to Deadpool's though.

 

[Bass]

Not sure about you Bass, but I intrepreted the whole 'Jean being b*tchy' thing as Phoenix foreshadowing. Think about it, if the inevitable Ultimate Phoenix plotline is going to be anything close to monumental to our fellow mutants, and likewise if it's going to follow 616, then Jean is gonna turn nasty evil-like. I figure Kirkman knows this and is simply setting it up.

Yes, I thought this was the case as the "Phoenix rising" plastered on the front, along with Lilandra showing up, kinda was a big, "The Phoenix is Coming!" foreshadowing.

However, I doubt this part is foreshadowing. You want to make Jean a terrifying wrath? Don't have her ***** to her boyfriend that he hasn't asked her to do anal. How about having her take over the entire cinema, completely freeze everyone and shut off their brains because she "wants time alone" (i.e. she's pissed off). To foreshadow the Phoenix you don't have her complain a bit. You have her use her powers in a disturbing fashion. Kirkman didn't do that, so I'm guessing this has nothing to do with the Phoenix, but just having her *****.

But I can't argue with a man who quotes Seven in his sig.

I liked the lilandra thing. Bass, I don't know if you're saying you wanted her to be an alien or what but if that's the case I have to disagree.

No no, not an alien. I'm saying that alien or no, she should still have the majesty and bearing she had in 616. See, in 616, Lilandra is the queen of an entire race of people, an Empress. A proper, hardcore, military leader, divine and fantastic, with an interstellar space-faring armada at her disposal, along with insanely powerful superhumans like Gladiator and uber-technology that dwarfs Earth's own advances.

In the Ultimate universe she seems to be a trust fund baby of a church - or something. It's not really all that clear or impressive.

While she may be something more, (it seems to me she's Hellfire Club II) she tells this to Xavier over dinner in a resteraunt.

All I'm saying is that Ultimate Lilandra should have the same quality of bearing, the same level of the fantastic on their first meeting, whether she's an alien or not. She should feel light years out of reach - alien or not, she should still feel like Lilandra.

I was trying to point out by Ultimizing Lilandra, they focused on keeping her "realistic" but they didn't make her "realisitic", they just trivialized her.

 

[TheManWithoutFear]

I see what you're saying. I could use some of that "majesty". There's still a chance.

 

[DIrishB]

Yes, I thought this was the case as the "Phoenix rising" plastered on the front, along with Lilandra showing up, kinda was a big, "The Phoenix is Coming!" foreshadowing.

However, I doubt this part is foreshadowing. You want to make Jean a terrifying wrath? Don't have her ***** to her boyfriend that he hasn't asked her to do anal. How about having her take over the entire cinema, completely freeze everyone and shut off their brains because she "wants time alone" (i.e. she's pissed off). To foreshadow the Phoenix you don't have her complain a bit. You have her use her powers in a disturbing fashion. Kirkman didn't do that, so I'm guessing this has nothing to do with the Phoenix, but just having her *****.

But I can't argue with a man who quotes Seven in his sig.

I think a sudden change like that defeats the purpose though. The Phoenix is (most likely) slowly gaining control of Jean, hence the slow but noticeable change in behavior. It starts small, but gets much worse.

No no, not an alien. I'm saying that alien or no, she should still have the majesty and bearing she had in 616. See, in 616, Lilandra is the queen of an entire race of people, an Empress. A proper, hardcore, military leader, divine and fantastic, with an interstellar space-faring armada at her disposal, along with insanely powerful superhumans like Gladiator and uber-technology that dwarfs Earth's own advances.

In the Ultimate universe she seems to be a trust fund baby of a church - or something. It's not really all that clear or impressive.

While she may be something more, (it seems to me she's Hellfire Club II) she tells this to Xavier over dinner in a resteraunt.

All I'm saying is that Ultimate Lilandra should have the same quality of bearing, the same level of the fantastic on their first meeting, whether she's an alien or not. She should feel light years out of reach - alien or not, she should still feel like Lilandra.

I was trying to point out by Ultimizing Lilandra, they focused on keeping her "realistic" but they didn't make her "realisitic", they just trivialized her.

So you'd like to see a more Jackie Kennedy Onassis like approach to the character? I can understand that.

 

[Ice]

Actually Bass, she's not in the new group of Hellfire Club. At least not yet. In the Handbook, it lists the current members, and she's not one of them.

 

[Bass]

I meant her "church" will no doubt worship the Phoenix just like the Hellfire club.

 

[Ice]

I meant her "church" will no doubt worship the Phoenix just like the Hellfire club.

Ahhhh, gotcha.

 

[X2727]

Someone has probably asked this before but..





WHO THE HECK IS THE MAGICIAN?!

 

[Ice]

Someone has probably asked this before but..





WHO THE HECK IS THE MAGICIAN?!

It's a brand new character by Kirkman.

 

[X2727]

It's a brand new character by Kirkman.

....................

a brand new, all original character in the Ultimate universe? :? AND joining the x-men? that's stupid.

 

[Ice]

....................

a brand new, all original character in the Ultimate universe? :? AND joining the x-men? that's stupid.

He's not the first new character. And who said he was joining the X-Men? I can't remember reading that.

 

[X2727]

who said he was joining the X-Men? I can't remember reading that.

I though ti read somewhere that he was joining. if hes not then the idea of an original characetr is less stupid then previously said.