Ultimate discussion panel/roundtable?
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Victor Von Doom
Fist of teh Internets.
I couldn't really find a more appropriate thread to say what I'm thinking at the moment on the UU....
Is it just me or can fans not really win when it comes to the UU?
I mean it seems like there is never a high point for the UU. The state of UU book quality is always fluxuating. When one book is down...another is up. And vice versa. There's never really been a "all the books are fantastic" kinda time frame.
Case point----UXM vs USM.
A couple months ago USM was in the middle of one of the worst runs the UU has ever seen. There's just no denying it. But at the opposite end of the spectrum, lay UXM. Kirkman's run on UXM started off pretty pisspoor but later found it's footing and was shaping up to be the premiere UU book.
But then like a bad 80s movie starring Judge Reinhold...things got all screwy and twisted around.
USM is looking to be on the mend and due for an enormous comeback in terms of quality and excitement. But meanwhile, Kirkman has dropped the ball on so many possibly great storylines and ideas. UXM is starting to look like it's 616 counterpart almost a year back and become "adjectiveless". It's like Kirkman was building up to this giant storyline....and now it's just so ho-hum.
And UFF isn't excluded from the rut. When Millar left, it took people a while to get into Carrey's way of writing and storyline. But once they got to issue 4-5 of Godwar, things seemed like UFF would be ok and we were gonna get "science fiction fanstastic" UFF and not "ZOMG! LOOK WUT CRAYZEE THING I MADE WITH MAH RUBBER MIND!" UFF. It looked as if we were safe. But as I've stated in other UFF threads....Carey isn't exactly wowing me like he was.
It seems as if he's got plenty of bright ideas and amazing concepts that he wants to introduce.....but he's failing at the execution part of the storytelling. It's like he's trying to tell us his vision but he can't find the right words.
Technically I'm just rambling right now. I was looking thru my UU comics and just noticed that they're never all great. They just go back and forth and up and down in terms of quality.
Meh.
Is it just me or can fans not really win when it comes to the UU?
I mean it seems like there is never a high point for the UU. The state of UU book quality is always fluxuating. When one book is down...another is up. And vice versa. There's never really been a "all the books are fantastic" kinda time frame.
Case point----UXM vs USM.
A couple months ago USM was in the middle of one of the worst runs the UU has ever seen. There's just no denying it. But at the opposite end of the spectrum, lay UXM. Kirkman's run on UXM started off pretty pisspoor but later found it's footing and was shaping up to be the premiere UU book.
But then like a bad 80s movie starring Judge Reinhold...things got all screwy and twisted around.
USM is looking to be on the mend and due for an enormous comeback in terms of quality and excitement. But meanwhile, Kirkman has dropped the ball on so many possibly great storylines and ideas. UXM is starting to look like it's 616 counterpart almost a year back and become "adjectiveless". It's like Kirkman was building up to this giant storyline....and now it's just so ho-hum.
And UFF isn't excluded from the rut. When Millar left, it took people a while to get into Carrey's way of writing and storyline. But once they got to issue 4-5 of Godwar, things seemed like UFF would be ok and we were gonna get "science fiction fanstastic" UFF and not "ZOMG! LOOK WUT CRAYZEE THING I MADE WITH MAH RUBBER MIND!" UFF. It looked as if we were safe. But as I've stated in other UFF threads....Carey isn't exactly wowing me like he was.
It seems as if he's got plenty of bright ideas and amazing concepts that he wants to introduce.....but he's failing at the execution part of the storytelling. It's like he's trying to tell us his vision but he can't find the right words.
Technically I'm just rambling right now. I was looking thru my UU comics and just noticed that they're never all great. They just go back and forth and up and down in terms of quality.
Meh.
Goodwill
Well-Known Member
The problem has been all the delays. When it was only Bendis, Millar, and another writer here and there the Universe was, for the most partly, tightly kit. Now, we've got titles not really schedule and the quality of each title decreases and, therefore, the Universe suffers.
I do feel as though what is to come will change this, though. They have at least acknowledged there was a problem - that's step one. I am optimistic at this point about where this stink will end up. It's teetering back and forth, as you mentioned and I like to think of myself as a half full kinda guy.
I do feel as though what is to come will change this, though. They have at least acknowledged there was a problem - that's step one. I am optimistic at this point about where this stink will end up. It's teetering back and forth, as you mentioned and I like to think of myself as a half full kinda guy.
Ice
Teh Sexy Monkey Queen
When has a Bendis book in the UU ever been late to the point it caused a problem? USM, the what, 5 times ever or so it was delayed has always been a week. UXM is another one that has been rarely been late.
Goodwill
Well-Known Member
Not saying Bendis. Just delays in general. There was a dependency, I guess, on the Ultimates because it was the title with the most activity from Fury and SHIELD... Who were, at one point, very much the commanding presence in the Universe. Now, that's definitely changing. Things are getting out of control. This is is also a trend with incontinuity, too.
Random
Didn't **** any of those *****es
I agree, really I think they just need to be constantly reminded of the basics that made the UU so great to begin with, just feels like they've been losing more and more touch with the style and reality the UU had when it began
Goodwill
Well-Known Member
Wanna bet that Origins will put the UU in its place again?
Delays have absolutely nothing to do with it. It's poor writing.
I agree about UXM - I've said before that the book isn't bad, but it's kind of boring. All this stuff going on and I don't really care, because it stopped being about mutants trying to fit in to a world that doesn't want them, and has turned into a Villain of the Week syndrome. And yes, it became that way when BKV was on the title, but he still made it work.
I can't agree that USM is getting so much better. I'm just not seeing it yet. The current story seems somewhat of an improvement, but that's about it.
I too believe that Origins will help things. Whatever they are doing to blow the whole thing up - it's desperately needed.
Victor Von Doom
Fist of teh Internets.
And all this ties back into the several claims that the UU isn't really needed.
Instead of grounding it in a more realistic universe....they've gotten just as campy as 616. It's really just a matter of time before we get Ultimate Xorn, Franklin Richards, and Onlasught.
Right now, my taste in comics has outgrown the UU so far that I really only read them out of habit. If I was to actually make myself stop buying the books and only read the TPBs (if that) I wouldn't really miss any of it. Hell...even my 616 list doesn't even have any Spidey, Wolverine, or continuity based X-Men. It's all secondary characters and random minis.
Instead of grounding it in a more realistic universe....they've gotten just as campy as 616. It's really just a matter of time before we get Ultimate Xorn, Franklin Richards, and Onlasught.
Right now, my taste in comics has outgrown the UU so far that I really only read them out of habit. If I was to actually make myself stop buying the books and only read the TPBs (if that) I wouldn't really miss any of it. Hell...even my 616 list doesn't even have any Spidey, Wolverine, or continuity based X-Men. It's all secondary characters and random minis.
Ice
Teh Sexy Monkey Queen
If Marvel is as..."passionate" about really forcing this MJ/Peter break-up, they'll do the same with never seeing Franklin Richards in the UU. Ultimate Xorn/Onslaught, though, that'll probably happen sometime. If they did Ultimate Clone Saga, I wouldn't be surprised if they the others.
But whatever, really. I'm still enjoying everything, with USM being now somewhat better the past couple issues or so than it has been before.
But whatever, really. I'm still enjoying everything, with USM being now somewhat better the past couple issues or so than it has been before.
I agree.
Same here. It's hard to go from reading a book like Fell, Planetary, etc. to reading any of the Ultimate books.
This is what I have been trying to tell you people. It's not going to get any better.
Victor Von Doom
Fist of teh Internets.
*GROWN UP COMICS HIGH FIVE!*
*GROWN UP COMICS HIGH FIVE!*
I never thought I'd turn into a comics snob. Especially since I still read some superhero books.
Victor Von Doom
Fist of teh Internets.
I don't know what's worse....the fact that you read comics? Or the fact that you're a snob about comics? :lol:
Hoorah for sarcasm.
Hoorah for sarcasm.
thee great one
Master of TOG-fu.
I would be fine with any of those if they change the concept of the characters into something more feasible. Like they did with Arcade, Mojo, etc.
TwilightEL
Well-Known Member
Franklin showing up would automatically be teh suck.
Why? Well, Sue and Reed are smart enough to know that they're not remotely ready to have a baby, even if they're genetically compatible--I don't think they're even having sex yet. I can't see them having a baby before marriage, either, and the writers won't marry them off for a really long time. Therefore, Franklin could only exist any time in the foreseeable future due to time travel, rape or some kind of hideous Marcus Immortus scenario. I apologize if the thought of any of those options led you to choke on your own bile. You will be missed.
Why? Well, Sue and Reed are smart enough to know that they're not remotely ready to have a baby, even if they're genetically compatible--I don't think they're even having sex yet. I can't see them having a baby before marriage, either, and the writers won't marry them off for a really long time. Therefore, Franklin could only exist any time in the foreseeable future due to time travel, rape or some kind of hideous Marcus Immortus scenario. I apologize if the thought of any of those options led you to choke on your own bile. You will be missed.
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Victor Von Doom
Fist of teh Internets.
Ice
Teh Sexy Monkey Queen
From Lying in the Gutters:
Bendis on Ultimate Spider-Man's legacy:
"It invented a more reader-friendly comic book. Even though it's 120 issues, you read that recap page, which by the way didn't exist in ancient comics prior to Ultimate Spider-Man. That was a Bill Jemas invention. The new writers don't want to bog down the writing with exposition, which is just lazy writing. So to do a recap like they do in front of 'Law & Order,' or 'Previously on ER,' to do that and get back right into the story. So that has now been applied to every comic book."
A Bill Jemas invention indeed, and one that appeared in "Nexus," "Bone," "Flaming Carrot," "Astro City," all the Milestone books, Penthouse Comix, "Deadpool"... and then pretty much every Marvel comic in the mid nineties, sporting a fold out cover recap page with an ad on the back, all before Jemas had editorial power.
Bendis on Ultimate Spider-Man's legacy:
"It invented a more reader-friendly comic book. Even though it's 120 issues, you read that recap page, which by the way didn't exist in ancient comics prior to Ultimate Spider-Man. That was a Bill Jemas invention. The new writers don't want to bog down the writing with exposition, which is just lazy writing. So to do a recap like they do in front of 'Law & Order,' or 'Previously on ER,' to do that and get back right into the story. So that has now been applied to every comic book."
A Bill Jemas invention indeed, and one that appeared in "Nexus," "Bone," "Flaming Carrot," "Astro City," all the Milestone books, Penthouse Comix, "Deadpool"... and then pretty much every Marvel comic in the mid nineties, sporting a fold out cover recap page with an ad on the back, all before Jemas had editorial power.
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Joe Kalicki
Well-Known Member
Yeah, Bendis is out of his mind with this one.
I remember the Marvel gatefolds of the 90s. They were even better than what they do now.
And exposition isn't lazy writing ins erial fiction. Being unable to do good exposition is lazy writing.
I remember the Marvel gatefolds of the 90s. They were even better than what they do now.
And exposition isn't lazy writing ins erial fiction. Being unable to do good exposition is lazy writing.
The ones they did during Heroes Reborn were epic. It was almost like getting an entire other comic.
