Ultimate Colossus

TheManWithoutFear said:
Pre-Annual Juggernaut would lose. Now he's an unstoppable force. And Project you're a sissy in the internet universe.
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I insult Juggernaut.

You insult me.

It's on!
 
Technically, by the rules of last man standing, Gambit lost.

See, when neither man is standing, you default to the 'last man breathing' clause. Gambit no longer breathing, Juggie breathing, Juggie wins! And the crowd goes wild.

That being said, Gambit was written pretty damn tricky by Vaughn. Case in point, he stymied the whole X-Men team and stole Rogue from under their nose. Colossus ain't that smooth.

And Colossus got beaten by Juggernaut during Weapon X. Occured of panel, which is dispointing. Still happened.

Then again Juggernaut got knocked out by Cap.

And cap is no stronger than Spider-Man.

Spider-Man knocked off the Rhino.

What am I getting at? You figure it out. And then, please tell me.
 
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E.Vi.L. said:
Technically, by the rules of last man standing, Gambit lost.

See, when neither man is standing, you default to the 'last man breathing' clause. Gambit no longer breathing, Juggie breathing, Juggie wins! And the crowd goes wild.

That being said, Gambit was written pretty damn tricky by Vaughn. Case in point, he stymied the whole X-Men team and stole Rogue from under their nose. Colossus ain't that smooth.

And Colossus got beaten by Juggernaut during Weapon X. Occured of panel, which is dispointing. Still happened.

Just a few random thoughts.
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True ultimately Gambit lost but he did give more trouble to Juggy than he's worth.

As for Gambit beating the X-Men, technically he only beat Iceman, and Wolverine, and that is probably because he was briefed on them and had the element of surprise.

Yeah I was *****in about the Jugg/Col. fight earlier in the thread, but I think that it can be assumed that Collosus has since gotten stronger.
 
I must have missed the Juggernaut's "addition of power", when did this happen?
 
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Iceshadow said:
Yeah I was *****in about the Jugg/Col. fight earlier in the thread, but I think that it can be assumed that Collosus has since gotten stronger.
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You think it can be assumed that Colossus has gotten stronger. Without evidence.

We Know Juggernaut has gotten stronger through exposure to the gem of Cythorak. And he won their first match.

So tell me, which is stronger, assumptions or facts?

Let's just say that if the authors need to have Juggernaut beat the crap out of Colossus, there is ebough establisged background story to justify it. And if they decide to have Colossus heroically win such a fight, good for them. Colossus has also been shown beating up on powerful people, such as Thor, so it's not much of a stretch either.
 
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is the annual the one where rogue gets gambit's powers? if not what happened in the annual? and since somebody said he got exposed to the cytorrak now does that mean he wasn't before? is he a mutant? all those q's being asked, I think he would crush colossus now. just like he did in 616 on a regular basis.
 
E.Vi.L. said:
You think it can be assumed that Colossus has gotten stronger. Without evidence.

We Know Juggernaut has gotten stronger through exposure to the gem of Cythorak. And he won their first match.

So tell me, which is stronger, assumptions or facts?

Let's just say that if the authors need to have Juggernaut beat the crap out of Colossus, there is ebough establisged background story to justify it. And if they decide to have Colossus heroically win such a fight, good for them. Colossus has also been shown beating up on powerful people, such as Thor, so it's not much of a stretch either.
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I remember hearing (a long while back) due to Colossus' young age it is entirely possible that he has not reached his peak potential. We have seen that with the proper motivation he can dramatically increase his strength (the sentinel stepping on him, and the fight with Magneto).
 
Synch said:
is the annual the one where rogue gets gambit's powers? if not what happened in the annual? and since somebody said he got exposed to the cytorrak now does that mean he wasn't before? is he a mutant? all those q's being asked, I think he would crush colossus now. just like he did in 616 on a regular basis.
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Yes, this is when Rogue gets his powers. But that's after Gambit fought Juggernaut and accidentally powered him up with the gem of Cytorak which they just stole from Fenris. No, he never had the gem before. Yes he's a mutant. And I think he'd beat Colossus too.
 
I'm pretty sure Juggernaut is weaker than Colossus in the Ultimate Universe. Even with the Gem, I think Colossus is far superior.
 
Iceshadow said:
We have seen that with the proper motivation he can dramatically increase his strength (the sentinel stepping on him, and the fight with Magneto).
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Yeah, him and every other 'tank' character in the history of the superhero comic genre. Even Spider-Man is routinely portrayed as much stronger when 'properly motivated' (mostly in 616 so far).

Goodwill said:
I'm pretty sure Juggernaut is weaker than Colossus in the Ultimate Universe. Even with the Gem, I think Colossus is far superior
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Need I remind you for a third time that Juggernaut won their first match? Without the Cythorak upgrade?

I'm not saying Colossus wouldn't win a rematch. In fact, that's rather likely given the WWElike nature of superhero fight. But we know he's not far superior. Know it for a fact. Otherwise, by definition of of the term 'far superior', he wouldn't have lost the first fight.

Any such conflict would be shown as being a very close call and if an author write Colossus winning, I bet it'll be through a bit of craftiness on Colossus part instead of raw strenght. It would be an occasion to highlight the fact that Peter isn't dumb while Juggernaut, frankly, is.

But powerwise? I'd be very surprised if any author chose to portray Colossus as tougher than Juggernaut. They're much more likley to take the occasion to write a fight in which he meets his match and where strenght alone can't save him.
 
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That was when Millar wrote and when things were contrived. For goodness' sake, Colossus stood up against Magneto... Would that really happen? Could Beast really take Magneto out? Doubtful.
 
Goodwill said:
That was when Millar wrote and when things were contrived. For goodness' sake, Colossus stood up against Magneto... Would that really happen?
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It's not impossible.

Goodwill said:
Could Beast really take Magneto out? Doubtful.
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He can hold his own.
 
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Goodwill said:
That was when Millar wrote and when things were contrived. For goodness' sake, Colossus stood up against Magneto... Would that really happen? Could Beast really take Magneto out? Doubtful.
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Why? He's definitely smarter than Magneto.

It's not all about strength.
 
Goodwill said:
That was when Millar wrote and when things were contrived. For goodness' sake, Colossus stood up against Magneto... Would that really happen? Could Beast really take Magneto out? Doubtful.
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'When Millar wrote X-Men' is over 50% of everything written about the UXM. So, you know, I wouldn't discount what he wrote. It's the basis for everything to come for a long time.

Colossus being strong enough to withstand Magneto pushing down on him isn' contrieved. Magneto not catapulting Colossus into the air as soon as he saw him resist is.

And Beast taking out Magneto? He is/was one of the Ultimate Universe top contender for the job. One of the few who has/had a shot to do it without any help. Amongst the other leading candidate : Spider-Man.

The key is to be agile enough to avoid getting hit by random flying metal oject, fast enough to close in with him and strong enough to take him out in one punch or two. And to be able to operate without relying on any metal, of course.

Beast is on the list of people who can do it.
 
E.Vi.L. said:
'When Millar wrote X-Men' is over 50% of everything written about the UXM. So, you know, I wouldn't discount what he wrote. It's the basis for everything to come for a long time.

Colossus being strong enough to withstand Magneto pushing down on him isn' contrieved. Magneto not catapulting Colossus into the air as soon as he saw him resist is.

And Beast taking out Magneto? He is/was one of the Ultimate Universe top contender for the job. One of the few who has/had a shot to do it without any help. Amongst the other leading candidate : Spider-Man.

The key is to be agile enough to avoid getting hit by random flying metal oject, fast enough to close in with him and strong enough to take him out in one punch or two. And to be able to operate without relying on any metal, of course.

Beast is on the list of people who can do it.
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Touche and well said.
 
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