Ultimate Alicia Masters (speculation)

But is she making frequent appearances? Well, I guess the better question is when was the last time she showed up?
 
Goodwill said:
But is she making frequent appearances? Well, I guess the better question is when was the last time she showed up?
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Last month, where the last story arc in MK: 4 was about her.
 
Thanks to Ice for taking that to a new thread.

Back on topic...
 
Goodwill said:
I only hope you're right... :)
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Well, look at what he's done with Jarvis in the Ultimates. From the issues I read from my friend that had Jarvis, he wasn't as interesting to read as now. In 616, he's just this, "yes sir", "Oh, no sir", and a good manner man overall, which by no means doesn't mean I don't like that. I'm just comparing him to the UU Jarvis, who has more attitude in him, and is quite interesting to read.


So MM can make Jarvis a more interesting character, he can too for Alicia.
 
Goodwill said:
Hey, they were going to make Thing African American in the Ultimate Universe... Hitch had originally intended for him to be African American when he was actually a man but they changed that for some reason. I wouldn't have minded that, though.
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I'm not fundamentally opposed to re-casting the ethnicities of comic book characters, but I think an African American Ben Grimm would've been a bad idea.

An African American Ben Grimm could've easily fall into the trap of being any number of black archetypes (sagely Morgan Freeman types, military bad-asses like Green Lantern, benevolent bear-like paternal figures like Dennis Haysbert) and end up being defined more by his race than by anything else.

It works for Ultimate Nick Fury because he's playing a pop cultural race role that melds with his position in the team well, which is that of a bad-*** from a long tradition of African American bad-asses (whether its the blaxploitation heroes, or the unapologetically ham-fisted Mr. T-types). Oh and neither Bendis nor Millar have really written African-American characters that aren't anything more than pop cultural archetypes.

The 616 Ben, being ostensibly Jewish and of a lower-class background worked because he served as the 'blue-collar contrast' to the stodgy professorial nature of Reed and the high society gal of Susan Storm and aw shucks enthusiasm of Johnny Storm. Amidst a team of Manhattan urbanites, Ben Grimm served as the grounding force for them all, and proved that you don't need skin color or sexuality to provide a strong contrast.

Goodwill said:
Alicia Masters being African American would be good... You know, fill the quota a bit. That title and Spider-Man are lacking racial differences.
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Again, I'm not against the principle of making any character African-American, but to do so for reasons of 'filling the quota' is not representation or racial diversity, it's just shameless tokenism.

I think an African-American Alicia Masters would be interesting if only because you can get away with making her father (assuming they are biologically related, as opposed to adoptive like in 616) black. That frees up the Ultimate Puppet Master to be something more like a vodoun bokor who uses gris gris to control people, rather than something stupid like atomic clay.
 
Damn, no post of the day outta that one? Tough crowd...

You can't really argue with an opinion, I guess. Ourchair, you believe that race could potentially make or a break a character... Even define a character. I'm afraid I don't agree with you. Let's take Ben, for example. If he were to be the jock archetype as the white version of Ben was in the actual issue of UFF, I don't think there would be any obvious change. Honestly, race does not necessarily have to function as it does in the real world, granted this is supposed to be a projection of political and pop culture. Who knows.

Anyway, either way, I'd like to see Alicia Masters be African American. Like the movie. It would be a change in pace from the white UU.
 
Goodwill said:
You can't really argue with an opinion, I guess. Ourchair, you believe that race could potentially make or a break a character... Even define a character.
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I know it sounds like I do, but I don't. My problem really isn't that there's anything fundamentally wrong with a black Ben or Alicia, it just doesn't sound like it'd add anything interesting. It's just different for different's sake.

As you put it, "I'd like to see Alicia Masters be African American. Like the movie. It would be a change in pace from the white UU." A character going from white to black being 'different' isn't a good enough reason to do it. It's not the same as 'it adds something to the character' or 'it further deepens your understanding of him'.

'Different' is what you use to justify giving characters diseases and making them wear protective armor with cybernetic arms without any consideration for theme and subtext. 'Different' is what you use to justify killing characters off without realizing its a mistake, and forcing yourself to resort to painfully convoluted resurrection schemes.

And to justify that by declaring that it'd "fill the quota a bit" because the comics are "lacking racial differences." is just a shameless call for racial tokenism. A black Nick Fury at least made sense with the increasing presence of high-ranking black people in the military and state affairs, as embodied by Colin Powell and Condoleeza Rice.
 
ourchair said:
I know it sounds like I do, but I don't. My problem really isn't that there's anything fundamentally wrong with a black Ben or Alicia, it just doesn't sound like it'd add anything interesting. It's just different for different's sake.
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As far as race goes, there's nothing wrong with that. In fact that's the only reason to make the change. For the sake of it.
 
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