Hawkeye101
Well-Known Member
moonmaster said:Have you read Watchmen?
No :sure:
My theory (Ultimates 2 #7 spoilers)
- Thread starter DIrishB
- Start date
No :sure:
GMaster
Banned
Go read it, then change your statement, and let your life be soo much better.Hawkeye101 said:
While your at it, read V for Vendetta.
Dr.Strangefate
He Sees You When You're Sleeping. He Knows When Yo
I second that.
Watchmen and V are two of the greatest Graphic Novels ever.
Watchmen and V are two of the greatest Graphic Novels ever.
Hawkeye101
Well-Known Member
I mainly read Ultimate titles. Why? I dunno, but if you insist. I'll take a peak. But i'm pretty old fashioned and like the good guys winning, even winning with scars.
TheManWithoutFear
#1 reason not to join UC
I started off reading Ultimate Titles only. Then it didn't fill my Daredevil/Hulk needs. Then I had to pick up New Avengers which got me into Young Avengers and HoM and Then Nigma got me into Runaways. Then a buddy of mine Got me into Cable/Deadpool. and so on and so on. Point is you're going to expand into other comic territories. When you do, you'll realize you have to see what the hype's all about with the classics and that leads you right into Watchmen which in turn makes you realize what gave birth to the kind of comics we're reading now. Maybe not anytime soon but you will read this book at some point.Hawkeye101 said:
On a personal note, regarding the PMs you sent me I find it unusual that you "like the good guys winning" when you read such a tragic character :wink:
Ultimate Travis
Active Member
- Joined
- Mar 8, 2005
- Messages
- 25
Hank Pym Is The Traitor!!
I really don't see how it could be anything other than this now, but if it is oh well. Mark Millar, if I'm correct you're a ****ing genius. If not, you've probably done something even better. Either way, you're mind****ing me up the ***!!
Theory:
Hank Pym hates Captain America for basically ruining his life. Not only did Captain America take Hank's place (and job) as the leader of the Ultimates after being uncovered in Iceland but he also humiliated him on more than one account and took his wife. So yeah, Hank does not like Captain America very much at all.
Hank Pym has mentioned before that he's on medication (when Cap's beating his ***) which indicates that he has some form of mental illness. Also, in the original universe, we know Hank Pym had a multiple personality disorder with his alternate ego being Yellowjacket.
Now, it is my belief in the Ultimates that the traitor is Hank Pym's alternate ego disquised as Captain America. How does this work? Well, we know that Pym has always had an infatuation w/being "the hero" that Cap is. And we know that he is bitter that Cap is the hero and deep down he probably wants to ruin Cap.
Now, I draw most of my evidence from issue #6, an issue I THOUGHT was just completely random and funny. However, once I began thinking about the possiblity of Hank Pym being the traitor, I realized how much it makes sense. For instance, I found it odd that they brought Hank back for an issue completely devoted to him after he hadn't even shown up for almost 3 issues (and was getting kicked off the team anyway). I believe this issue was not only for relief but also a way to personalize his character more and also tease you into thinking he was redeeming himself in some sort of pathetic way. Just like the scene where he is talking to Janet Pym and Cap comes over to threaten him. Later on in the issue, I found it interesting that his girlfriend asks him to dress up like Cap America. At first, I thought it was just a funny, ironic joke, but now I can see it as a major hint. He has a Cap costume You can see it lying on his bed in the 3rd panel of page 33, issue 6, vol. 2.
In addition, Hank is the only person who has spoken to the traitor. Could he just be talking to himself? I think that he believes that he is speaking to another member of the Ultimates. Perhaps he believes he is speaking with (and seeing)Tony Stark(or Loki, or Cap himself, some other Ult, really don't matter), whom would either be:
A)Hank's alternate ego as he pretends to dress up as Cap & frame him
B)convince Hank to dress up as Cap and frame him
C)if it's the Cap alternate ego, he just pretends he's Cap being the traitor
Either way, the Traitor is Hank Pym acting thru some f***ed up, hallucinating alter ego, which probably manifests itself through his hatred of Cap America and his own self-loathing. Hank's bad alter ego snitched on Banner. This bad alter ego went on to inform normal Pym of what was happening (thru hallucination or w/e goes on w/ these types of disorders) and normal decent Pym helps Banner escape.
This all goes to form the basic concept that Hank Pym is so obsessed w/ this "hero" idea that he goes on to form an imaginary conflict of good & evil in his head in which he, the conscious Hank, is the good guy and the bad guy in some shape or form is Captain America. He's so down & out that he constructs this elaborate plot in his head, starts acting it out, Loki catches on, adn all hell is unleashed.
I hope this made some sense. It's al lot to write and my wording could be totally screwing up the explanation.
I have no idea if this is what's going to happen, but I just don't see what else it could be. None of the other Ults seem to fit the traitor position entirely and any other reserve supersolder or w/e would just seem...well, not that schock inducing because we dont care as much about them.
I really don't see how it could be anything other than this now, but if it is oh well. Mark Millar, if I'm correct you're a ****ing genius. If not, you've probably done something even better. Either way, you're mind****ing me up the ***!!
Theory:
Hank Pym hates Captain America for basically ruining his life. Not only did Captain America take Hank's place (and job) as the leader of the Ultimates after being uncovered in Iceland but he also humiliated him on more than one account and took his wife. So yeah, Hank does not like Captain America very much at all.
Hank Pym has mentioned before that he's on medication (when Cap's beating his ***) which indicates that he has some form of mental illness. Also, in the original universe, we know Hank Pym had a multiple personality disorder with his alternate ego being Yellowjacket.
Now, it is my belief in the Ultimates that the traitor is Hank Pym's alternate ego disquised as Captain America. How does this work? Well, we know that Pym has always had an infatuation w/being "the hero" that Cap is. And we know that he is bitter that Cap is the hero and deep down he probably wants to ruin Cap.
Now, I draw most of my evidence from issue #6, an issue I THOUGHT was just completely random and funny. However, once I began thinking about the possiblity of Hank Pym being the traitor, I realized how much it makes sense. For instance, I found it odd that they brought Hank back for an issue completely devoted to him after he hadn't even shown up for almost 3 issues (and was getting kicked off the team anyway). I believe this issue was not only for relief but also a way to personalize his character more and also tease you into thinking he was redeeming himself in some sort of pathetic way. Just like the scene where he is talking to Janet Pym and Cap comes over to threaten him. Later on in the issue, I found it interesting that his girlfriend asks him to dress up like Cap America. At first, I thought it was just a funny, ironic joke, but now I can see it as a major hint. He has a Cap costume You can see it lying on his bed in the 3rd panel of page 33, issue 6, vol. 2.
In addition, Hank is the only person who has spoken to the traitor. Could he just be talking to himself? I think that he believes that he is speaking to another member of the Ultimates. Perhaps he believes he is speaking with (and seeing)Tony Stark(or Loki, or Cap himself, some other Ult, really don't matter), whom would either be:
A)Hank's alternate ego as he pretends to dress up as Cap & frame him
B)convince Hank to dress up as Cap and frame him
C)if it's the Cap alternate ego, he just pretends he's Cap being the traitor
Either way, the Traitor is Hank Pym acting thru some f***ed up, hallucinating alter ego, which probably manifests itself through his hatred of Cap America and his own self-loathing. Hank's bad alter ego snitched on Banner. This bad alter ego went on to inform normal Pym of what was happening (thru hallucination or w/e goes on w/ these types of disorders) and normal decent Pym helps Banner escape.
This all goes to form the basic concept that Hank Pym is so obsessed w/ this "hero" idea that he goes on to form an imaginary conflict of good & evil in his head in which he, the conscious Hank, is the good guy and the bad guy in some shape or form is Captain America. He's so down & out that he constructs this elaborate plot in his head, starts acting it out, Loki catches on, adn all hell is unleashed.
I hope this made some sense. It's al lot to write and my wording could be totally screwing up the explanation.
I have no idea if this is what's going to happen, but I just don't see what else it could be. None of the other Ults seem to fit the traitor position entirely and any other reserve supersolder or w/e would just seem...well, not that schock inducing because we dont care as much about them.
bizzarojimmyolsen
Member
- Joined
- Sep 4, 2005
- Messages
- 8
ranaj said:
Cap probably weighs 250 but out in the field full equipped he may be closer to 300.
DIrishB
The Timeline Guy
UltimateTravis makes a lot of good points with his theory, and it very well could work out that way. Its just Millar has done a spectacular job of keeping almost everyone on the team just as likely a suspect. By no means is this predictable.
Guijllons
Well-Known Member
I'm not convinced the traitor was actually dressed in costume. Why would he do that if he was being all covert? And besides, Fury would need a bit more than just a costume to go on to go crazy on Cap. Otherwise, I'm interested in the dual personality thing, but it does sting of being a little bit of a cop-out clause, a previously non-introduced element.
DIrishB
The Timeline Guy
Guijllons said:
But even in that sense any evidence could be faked/planted.
I agree in that sense, though its not so much of a cop-out in the sense we've known about Hank's problems since the character was introduced. Yes the split-personality thing would be a surprise, but alluding to or covering it earlier (if that is the case) would have made it obvious Hank was probably the traitor. As it stands now it could still be anyone and everyone on the team has just as much evidence or reason for it to be them as any other, making figuring it out that much more difficult. Thats why Millar is the man.
