Indiana Jones 4 discussion (Spoilers!)

[Dr.Strangefate]

And Indy is just badass in ToD, I dunno how you think he's bumbling.

He never shows the intelligence he is capable of in that movie. At no point does the Smart-Indy show his head, and that's what makes him compelling, he's a professor AND an action hero. The fact that a smart person kicks so much *** makes it better, and in all the other movies they take the time to show it.

Otherwise, I'd agree. It's definitely better on a second viewing. Obviously, you're not going to change your mind if you hate it, but those that are conflicted should do themselves the favor of rewatching it.

I didn't hate it, i really enjoyed it, moreso than I thought I was going to. But I am not willing to put it on the same level as Crusade or Raiders, because it is simply not as good a movie. It has decent moments, and was lots of fun, but that doesn't excuse the fact that it could have had such a better script. The fact that this better script did exist (Tom Stoppard, the playwright behind Rosencrantz and Guildenstern are Dead, Arcadia, and Coast of Utopia, wrote a script that George Lucas deemed too intelligent for a kid's movie, despite the fact that both Ford and Spielberg loved it) makes me crazy. Sooo Crazy.

For me, what bothers me, is all the things it could have done, but didn't... Hopefully the next one returns to Judeo-Christian Mythology. Maybe even covering an Islamic artifact, completing the Jerusalem religions... Judaism in Raiders, Christianity in Last Crusade, and then maybe Islam in the next. With filler movies in between.

For what it is, its good. But it should have been great, and there's no good reason that kept it for being so.


As I think I said, 7.5/10.

My Indy Rankings:
Raiders of the Lost Ark - 10/10
Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade - 9.75/10
Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull - 7.5/10
Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom - 4/10

 

[Ice]

I like all the Indy movies. But whatever.

 

[Dr.Strangefate]

(you said that on the last page too. pretty much exactly)

*pats Ice gently on the head as he goes senile*

 

[Lynx]

I like all the Indy movies. But whatever.

I do, too. I like in varying degrees (Raiders and Crusade, I love, Temple and Kingdom I find to be fun), though.

He never shows the intelligence he is capable of in that movie. At no point does the Smart-Indy show his head, and that's what makes him compelling, he's a professor AND an action hero. The fact that a smart person kicks so much *** makes it better, and in all the other movies they take the time to show it.

I think that's just because Temple focused less on archeology and his teaching career. Which, funnily enough, is almost the direct opposite of Kingdom, where they drive home the fact that he's also a professor. He's basically "becoming" his father.

 

[Dr.Strangefate]

I think that's just because Temple focused less on archeology and his teaching career.

Which is exactly the reason the movie is less intelligent... It was just another mindless action film, which the other films never were. It was just such a bizarre way to follow up a great movie... I simply cannot understand why they would take the one angle of the first film that made it totally unique and throw it out the window for your typical "good guy beats bad guy, wins girl at the end" movie. I'm not saying raiders doesn't follow that same idea, but it did it in such an interesting way...

Bleh. I hereby swear to re-watch that movie in the next couple of weeks and come up with a more valid critique. Maybe i missed something.

 

[Ice]

(you said that on the last page too. pretty much exactly)

*pats Ice gently on the head as he goes senile*

Just restating my thoughts.

*Punches DSF in the throat*

 

[Planet-man]

Which is exactly the reason the movie is less intelligent... It was just another mindless action film, which the other films never were. It was just such a bizarre way to follow up a great movie... I simply cannot understand why they would take the one angle of the first film that made it totally unique and throw it out the window for your typical "good guy beats bad guy, wins girl at the end" movie. I'm not saying raiders doesn't follow that same idea, but it did it in such an interesting way...

Bleh. I hereby swear to re-watch that movie in the next couple of weeks and come up with a more valid critique. Maybe i missed something.

I doubt you've missed anything.

There's no doubt Temple is the biggest deviation from the overall essence of the Indiana Jones series. It has the least to do with Archaeology and war and globe-spanning.... after Shanghai, the whole movie takes place within perhaps fifty square miles. Willie is a vastly different love interest for Indy, and Short Round is a kind of bizarre inclusion. The whole adventure occurs completely by chance due to where they ended up after a plane crash, as opposed to a mapped-out quest.

What Temple is to me is sort of an "expansion pack". The series could work without it I guess, but its presence still deepens the character and his mythos and provides some of the best and most classic Indy scenes ever(the rope bridge for example.... most people see a rope bridge in the jungle and immeadiately think of Indiana Jones, and it's because of this movie. Also, the bugs/spikes sequence is easily one of the most suspenceful in anything, every single time). Personally, I think Willie's dynamic with Indy is a great and necessary one to do, and Short Round works surprisingly well, partially a sort of father/son thing(which is a theme that's continued in every movie since), partially just a good buddy thing. It's a very well-made movie too, and again, Indy just wouldn't be the same to me without it. That's why I love it.

 

[marvelman]

also, DSF- Indy does show his smarts some in Temple of Doom- remember at the dinner when he is trading history blows with the prime minister's assistant and the british general?

 

[Gothamite]

I doubt you've missed anything.

There's no doubt Temple is the biggest deviation from the overall essence of the Indiana Jones series. It has the least to do with Archaeology and war and globe-spanning.... after Shanghai, the whole movie takes place within perhaps fifty square miles. Willie is a vastly different love interest for Indy, and Short Round is a kind of bizarre inclusion. The whole adventure occurs completely by chance due to where they ended up after a plane crash, as opposed to a mapped-out quest.

What Temple is to me is sort of an "expansion pack". The series could work without it I guess, but its presence still deepens the character and his mythos and provides some of the best and most classic Indy scenes ever(the rope bridge for example.... most people see a rope bridge in the jungle and immeadiately think of Indiana Jones, and it's because of this movie. Also, the bugs/spikes sequence is easily one of the most suspenceful in anything, every single time). Personally, I think Willie's dynamic with Indy is a great and necessary one to do, and Short Round works surprisingly well, partially a sort of father/son thing(which is a theme that's continued in every movie since), partially just a good buddy thing. It's a very well-made movie too, and again, Indy just wouldn't be the same to me without it. That's why I love it.

I like Temple of Doom because it's a movie that's just about 'Indiana' the romantic alter-ego and not Henry Jr the bumbling college professor. It abandons all the human aspects of the character that he's ashamed of or would rather live without (his strained relationship with Marion and his father) and instead focuses entirely on the exciting, romantic he-man lifestyle he would like to live. Even the love interest isn't someone who can keep up with Indy and is what one would imagine to be the typical Bond-girl bimbo Indy shacks up with on a good weekend. It's also really cool that it's a prequel, because we get a slightly looser, shallower Indy who's more interested in 'fortune and glory' than the greater good of archeology.

Basically, Temple made Indiana a more rugged, fantasy, mysterious character rather than a likeable hero with human problems (like in the other two).

 

[Grocer Man]

Just saw this. It was good.

A ancient temple built around a UFO was pure pulpy goodness.

Also, during the monkeys scene, my first thought was "Ampersand!"

 

[Iceshadow]

Saw this tonight, meh.

 

[Gothamite]

Saw this tonight, meh.

I think if I hadn't read the less than stellar reviews beforehand, and I'd gone in expecting a mindblowing masterpiece, I would have been bitterly disappointed. Luckily, I expected a flawed movie and I was still satisfied.

See: Spider-Man 3

 

[Lynx]

I think if I hadn't read the less than stellar reviews beforehand, and I'd gone in expecting a mindblowing masterpiece, I would have been bitterly disappointed. Luckily, I expected a flawed movie and I was still satisfied.

See: Spider-Man 3

It was better than Spider-Man 3.

Anyways, I'm going to start watching Young Indy today. I've heard mixed things, but I'm hoping I can get into it.

 

[Dr.Strangefate]

I also want to get into Young Indy, since my parents got me the first two volumes for my birthday.

 

[Lynx]

I also want to get into Young Indy, since my parents got me the first two volumes for my birthday.

I'm in the middle of the first "movie", My First Adventure. It's actually fairly decent. The tone (At least in these early years, since he's only supposed to be 10) is decidedly different from the movies, but, as a fan of history, I'm finding it enjoyable.

The only thing that irked the hell out of me was the price. I can't believe Lucas got away charging nearly a hundred bucks for each set. Money grubbing bastard.

Also picked up The Lost Journal of Indiana Jones. Very nice book. Makes a great coffee table book.

 

[DIrishB]

Just saw this. It was good.

A ancient temple built around a UFO was pure pulpy goodness.

Also, during the monkeys scene, my first thought was "Ampersand!"

For me, it was "Yep, there's the Jar-Jar scene for this movie..."


But whatever, very forgivable given the goodness of the rest of the film.

It was better than Spider-Man 3.

Anyways, I'm going to start watching Young Indy today. I've heard mixed things, but I'm hoping I can get into it.

I also want to get into Young Indy, since my parents got me the first two volumes for my birthday.

I'm in the middle of the first "movie", My First Adventure. It's actually fairly decent. The tone (At least in these early years, since he's only supposed to be 10) is decidedly different from the movies, but, as a fan of history, I'm finding it enjoyable.

The only thing that irked the hell out of me was the price. I can't believe Lucas got away charging nearly a hundred bucks for each set. Money grubbing bastard.

Also picked up The Lost Journal of Indiana Jones. Very nice book. Makes a great coffee table book.

I checked out the full run of the Young Indy adventures a few months ago (getting prepped for Indy 4). I was a bit bored by the first 5 episodes with 10 year old Indy, but once I got into the teenage episodes (where Indy is in WWI and after) I really enjoyed them. Basically, Vol. 1 is a bit dry and boring (though the last two movies/episodes on Vol. 1 were pretty good), and Vol. 2-3 are almost worth their price (if you like special features...otherwise they're horribly overpriced).

 

[Lynx]

I checked out the full run of the Young Indy adventures a few months ago (getting prepped for Indy 4). I was a bit bored by the first 5 episodes with 10 year old Indy, but once I got into the teenage episodes (where Indy is in WWI and after) I really enjoyed them. Basically, Vol. 1 is a bit dry and boring (though the last two movies/episodes on Vol. 1 were pretty good), and Vol. 2-3 are almost worth their price (if you like special features...otherwise they're horribly overpriced).

I think I'm going to check out the special features, just so I get my money's worth.

 

[DIrishB]

I think I'm going to check out the special features, just so I get my money's worth.

I recommend it. I'm not usually a special features type of guy, but I'm planning on checking out the various documentaries for the same reason.

 

[Gothamite]

It was better than Spider-Man 3.

Anyways, I'm going to start watching Young Indy today. I've heard mixed things, but I'm hoping I can get into it.

Yeah, I know. But it wasn't as mindblowing as any of the other ones and neither was Spider-Man 3 compared to its first two movies. The point is that I knew this in advance for Indy IV and Spidey 3 and it helped me to enjoy them on a purely fun factor.

Indy was still waaay better than Spider-Man 3.

 

[DIrishB]

Anyone read any of the Indy novels? I tore through IJ & The Peril at Delphi and IJ & The Dance of the Giants and enjoyed them.