René
Starring in "The Longest Yard", opening Memorial D
God, please dont start that wit me fine. What the **** is the internet? :arrgh:Nurhachi said:Dude, if its on TV it must be real
God, please dont start that wit me fine. What the **** is the internet? :arrgh:Nurhachi said:Dude, if its on TV it must be real
Well, I'll admit that I'm not always clear when I post because of my tendency towards polysyllabic ramble, but I think I was pretty clear when I ended my thread opener with: "Any thoughts on D/F? or even comic book slash in general?"Nurhachi said:I think we just didnt understand what you were saying when you started this thread.
Miller is a nutcase, anyway.Baxter said:This smacks of Millers interpretation of The Joker/Batman relationship.
Eew.
Yes, but the Japanese are a little paradox, the more tabooa subject the more they seem to integrate it into thier mediums. Just don't bring it up at the dinner table.ourchair said:Miller is a nutcase, anyway.
Well honestly, I don't buy into lame homoerotic interpretations either, but I just think they're funny. And the absence of it in comics fandom is just well, surprising considering how prevalent it is in Japanese fandom.
True. They're technically a rigid society that is quite interestingly more permissive about how pop culture breaks down their social conventions through wildly transgressive means like apocalyptic fiction, gender-sexuality play and transformation epics.Baxter said:Yes, but the Japanese are a little paradox, the more tabooa subject the more they seem to integrate it into thier mediums. Just don't bring it up at the dinner table.
Ah, a serious response.Guijllons said:Really what you're talking about is respect.
So many of these big fights come down to macho slogan swinging and chest puffing postulating. Each of the characters eying each other up as they circle about, before they get to rutting. This is done to eye up the opponent, to understand that they are powerful, and to find a weakness. And this is where the homo-eroticism comes in.
Most heroes respect that they can be damaged by the other person, that they have power over them, possible domination even, and from the comes the respect. Reed and Doom have no respect for each other really, they don't rate each others work, and nor as men.
So you're saying that Van Damme, by his very arrogance and imperious attitude, would only acknowledge Reed if he were to receive advances from him. But you ask, "who is the dominant party in the act of fellatio?" and you don't answer this for me. So who IS dominantGuijllons said:There is no real rivalry on Reeds part at least. If anything, Damme does have this desire to prove that he cannot be beaten and is worthy of respect which puts him in an interesting place on the sexual conflict table.
He doesn't wish to be immediately dominant, but to be the recipient of the advances of Reed. As in, who is the dominant party in the act of fellatio?
So in a sense we can see Van Damme as submissive to Reed due to his arrogance.
Now you mentioned an awful lot of japanese stuff there that I have no knowledge of, so on that I can't comment.
Truly an intriguing thoughts, Guij. I like how you dichotomized the two scientists, and it applies even within a 616 context. Okay, our discussion has made me satisfied enough NOT to regret starting this thread.Guijllons said:Van Damme would be the recipient here. Though dominant, it's a more passive position. Reed is actively seeking exchange, and Van Damme merely in acceptance, and grateful for the exchange. Though using the fellatio metaphor could be misleading because Reed considers the exchange a purely practical one, and I only use it in the context of this discussion.
I think the difference really between the characters is that Reed is essentially a pragmatic and Van Damme a romantic. Reed tests high grade explosives without thinking of how it would effect others should it go wrong, and Van Damme thinks he is a king.
And that essentially is why I see no true homo-erotic subtext, because Reed does not share this desire to dominate the other party, but merely to get what is required. Though the same point can equally be argued for the reverse.
Thats because of the directly sexual nature of many anime and manga series. There's a lot more commonly flat out dirty anime and manga out there than there are mainstream comics.ourchair said:Really, I know some of you, well, all of you are freaked out, but I thought it was an interesting point of discussion for those into the transgressive uses and appropriation of pop culture. Now that I think about it, comic book slash doesn't seem to appear as often as slash for anime and manga characters.
Guijllons said:Not to mention Xavier and Magento. They define each other by their own existence, and both have this this superior desire.
Guijllons said:Reed cannot respect a man that makes errors, simply because, as he states, he does not.
compound said:I believe this is *precisely* what Millar implied during "World Tour". Xavier and Magneto so perfectly completmented each other's skills and world-view that it caused Xavier to regard Moria and David as somehow 'beneath him', hence his generally neglectful behavior towards his own wife and son.
It isn't difficult for actually a huge number of characters if you think about it. The rivalry/opposition complex is a traditional outlet for various kinds of tension or jealousy.compound said:And from there, it's not very had to imagine the original Xavier/Erik partnership taking on more... intimate... qualities.
It's not so difficult to picture a Reed and Van Damme union, given similar circumstances.