Spider-Man The Great Jane Debate!

[Lil Brother]

Hehe, that's fun to say.

So we all know about the whole MJ deal. Some people say Peter being married alienates younger/singler readers and ruins what makes Spider-Man so great. Others think it was nice for typical Parker luck to turn to good luck for once and for Spider-Man to actually grow up a bit more and getting married. But this thread isn't about that, really.

...so wtf is it about?

It's about the fact that Spider-Man is an unapproachable character. OMG is it cuz he's married? Um, no. Lots of people get married. That's not a problem. What's making Spider-Man a distant character is all this unrealistic crap. I mean, yeah, he's a friggin' super hero, of course silly things happen to him all the time. But that's Spider-Man's life. Peter Parker himself has gotten way to caught up in Spider-Man's web.

Oh God, it's a "complain about the Civil War reveal" thread!

Yeah, but it was screwed up before then. Spider-Man's identity being known to other super heroes if fair enough, it makes sense that that would happen. Joining the Avengers is not outside the realm of possibilty. Living in a giant tower known for being the headquarters of super heroes. Yeeeah, now we're pushing it a bit. But Peter will eventually get back to the normal life, right? Whoops, he took his mask off on national television. Yeah, totally unapproachable. Can you tell us why, Joe Quesada?

Quesada: He's married to a super model!

Yes, I'm sure that's it.

I hate that Peter Parker has pretty much crossed the line of being a character recognized easily by readers. I hate that the people at Marvel tihnk this is a good idea. I hate that they say they plan on having Spider-Man going back to his roots, then immediately do something this idiotic. I hate that they blame his marriage for the incresing distance despite the fact that he has been married for ages.

I do think that the Spider-Man books had become foul prior to Civil War and that some serious changes were in need. I know that Marvel probably has some big plan to fix everything and get everything back to the way they were supposed to be. I know I need to be patient and wait for everything to hopefully cool down. But it seems like forever ago that this crap started to happen and all that's happening is Peter Parker is getting farther and farther away!

And it goes back to the Mary Jane thing. What goes through these guys' heads? "Oh, I can't relate to this character because he has a hot wife. But once he becomes a celebrity and then a convict I can definetly see where he's coming from."

Cann anyone explain to me the logic of all these "brilliant" changes?

Utter spam, I know, but I just had to type this all out. Sorry.

 

[Joe Kalicki]

They'll probably have Peter end up making everyone forget who he is, or "rebooting" his life somehow, or something and so Mary Jane and Aunt May and everyone will have no idea he's Spider-Man or whatever.

No divorce, no widower, no married Spider-Man and a secret ID again. I'm calling it.

 

[Gideon Stargrave]

They'll probably have Peter end up making everyone forget who he is, or "rebooting" his life somehow, or something and so Mary Jane and Aunt May and everyone will have no idea he's Spider-Man or whatever.

No divorce, no widower, no married Spider-Man and a secret ID again. I'm calling it.

First of all...this is why Ultimate Spider-Man exists.

Second of all, Joey Q said that "The marvel universe will not just be 'go back to the way it was' at the end of civil war". You guys are complaining about Spider-Man no longer being the hero that you love now that he's taken off his mask and become a fugitive. I see it as just another story arc. People said the same thing when he graduated from high school, they said the same thing when Gwen died, they said the same thing when he graduated from college, they said the same thing at the end of the Clone saga, they said the same thing when Ben Reilly took over as Spider-Man, they said the same thing when we found out he had totemic powers, they...the point is, Spidey has not been ruined forever. This is just another story opportunity.

 

[Ice]

No divorce, no widower, no married Spider-Man and a secret ID again. I'm calling it.

*Ahem*

[MWF]BLAH! BLAH! BLAH! NO ONE CALLS ANYTHING! I MADE A RULE ON THAT! BLAH! BLAH! BLAH![/MWF]


Eeeeend scene.

 

[Joe Kalicki]

First of all...this is why Ultimate Spider-Man exists.

Second of all, Joey Q said that "The marvel universe will not just be 'go back to the way it was' at the end of civil war". You guys are complaining about Spider-Man no longer being the hero that you love now that he's taken off his mask and become a fugitive. I see it as just another story arc. People said the same thing when he graduated from high school, they said the same thing when Gwen died, they said the same thing when he graduated from college, they said the same thing at the end of the Clone saga, they said the same thing when Ben Reilly took over as Spider-Man, they said the same thing when we found out he had totemic powers, they...the point is, Spidey has not been ruined forever. This is just another story opportunity.

I never said Spider-Man's ruined or that this is what I want to happen.

I just think it is what will happen. Just because the Marvel Universe won't go back the way it was doesn't mean Spider-Man won't change. Or regress, if you like.

 

[Gideon Stargrave]

I never said Spider-Man's ruined or that this is what I want to happen.

I just think it is what will happen. Just because the Marvel Universe won't go back the way it was doesn't mean Spider-Man won't change. Or regress, if you like.

Ok, maybe I went overboard...a little. But I can't see a spidey reboot happening any time soon.

 

[E]

Ok, maybe I went overboard...a little. But I can't see a spidey reboot happening any time soon.

Me either. How could they do it without an Onslaught or House of M-style retcon? That would go over like a lead balloon.

 

[Dr.Strangefate]

Mephisto.

Spidey sells his soul for a new identity, or summink like that.

(I hope not, but that's how they'd do it if they wanted to take the easy route)

Here's my theory:

- Post Civil War: Spider-Man is a fugitive from the government (which we know). He is hunted, so he puts on the black costume to avoid the registered heroes from capturing and putting him in SHIELD custody. He attempts to live his life in NYC all but abandoning his identity.

- Mary Jane and Aunt May, under constant surveilance, are stressed to high heaven by the upheaval in their lives. They continue to live in Stark towers, but more as prisoners than houseguests.

- Through the intervention of Nick Fury, and coordinating with Jarvis being distracted by May, Peter and MJ are allowed "One More Day" together outside of SHIELD surveilance. Peter tells MJ that although he loves her, and will always love her, he cannot keep making her life a living hell. He tells her that he is going to go into hiding under a new identity and that he will not tell her what that identity is, and that he may never see her again. They spend the night together and when she wakes up, he is gone. To make the desire to hunt him down go away Dr. Strange makes her think that Peter has been killed (since Wizard revealed that the "One More Day" story includes Dr. Strange).

- Spider-Man shows up in Chicago, or some other American city, with a new identity. Every few months or so he moves, or he builds up a steady life in one place until the Government liscensed Green Goblin hunts him down, and he's forced to adopt a new life. He remains a member of Captain America's Secret Avengers, working for Fury, but only occasionally. He gets a job as a teacher maybe.

- Meanwhile, MJ realizes she's pregnant, unbeknownst to Peter, and she and Aunt May decide to raise to child far away from New York City. Tony Stark (probably running SHIELD by now) puts her in something like the witness protection program and sends her out into suburbia as a last favor to his friend Peter. Maybe Jarvis moves with them. Maybe Jarvis' witness protection name is Ben and little Peter Parker Jr. has an uncle who can teach him a thing or two about responsibility. Who knows, really.

This Way:
- Helps introduce new supporting cast.
- Single Peter Parker
- No Divorce
- No Death
- Heartbreaking, Defining story with long-lasting ramifications.
- Failsafe to reintroduce the Status-Quo if fan-reception doesn't flow with these moves

Just some speculation on my behalf, but from the preview art I am ABSOLUTELTY convinced that I am right about "One Day More" being the last day MJ and Peter have together.

 

[ProjectX2]

I love that idea, Doctor Strangefate. It fits perfectly.

I'm really thinking that this is what Millar/Hitch are doing after Civil War. They're rebooting Spider-Man somehow...

 

[Friday]

Mephisto.

Spidey sells his soul for a new identity, or summink like that.

(I hope not, but that's how they'd do it if they wanted to take the easy route)

Here's my theory:

- Post Civil War: Spider-Man is a fugitive from the government (which we know). He is hunted, so he puts on the black costume to avoid the registered heroes from capturing and putting him in SHIELD custody. He attempts to live his life in NYC all but abandoning his identity.

- Mary Jane and Aunt May, under constant surveilance, are stressed to high heaven by the upheaval in their lives. They continue to live in Stark towers, but more as prisoners than houseguests.

- Through the intervention of Nick Fury, and coordinating with Jarvis being distracted by May, Peter and MJ are allowed "One More Day" together outside of SHIELD surveilance. Peter tells MJ that although he loves her, and will always love her, he cannot keep making her life a living hell. He tells her that he is going to go into hiding under a new identity and that he will not tell her what that identity is, and that he may never see her again. They spend the night together and when she wakes up, he is gone. To make the desire to hunt him down go away Dr. Strange makes her think that Peter has been killed (since Wizard revealed that the "One More Day" story includes Dr. Strange).

- Spider-Man shows up in Chicago, or some other American city, with a new identity. Every few months or so he moves, or he builds up a steady life in one place until the Government liscensed Green Goblin hunts him down, and he's forced to adopt a new life. He remains a member of Captain America's Secret Avengers, working for Fury, but only occasionally. He gets a job as a teacher maybe.

- Meanwhile, MJ realizes she's pregnant, unbeknownst to Peter, and she and Aunt May decide to raise to child far away from New York City. Tony Stark (probably running SHIELD by now) puts her in something like the witness protection program and sends her out into suburbia as a last favor to his friend Peter. Maybe Jarvis moves with them. Maybe Jarvis' witness protection name is Ben and little Peter Parker Jr. has an uncle who can teach him a thing or two about responsibility. Who knows, really.

This Way:
- Helps introduce new supporting cast.
- Single Peter Parker
- No Divorce
- No Death
- Heartbreaking, Defining story with long-lasting ramifications.
- Failsafe to reintroduce the Status-Quo if fan-reception doesn't flow with these moves

Just some speculation on my behalf, but from the preview art I am ABSOLUTELTY convinced that I am right about "One Day More" being the last day MJ and Peter have together.

So thats pretty much what I was thinking as I was reading down this thread except I had him faking his death.

 

[Dr.Strangefate]

So thats pretty much what I was thinking as I was reading down this thread except I had him faking his death.

I had that, but then what is Dr. Strange gonna do?

Just trying to be fair to everyone's favorite magical surgeon.

 

[Friday]

I had that, but then what is Dr. Strange gonna do?

Be suave. Thats all he needs to do.

 

[Joe Kalicki]

Well, the full magical "rebooting" of Spider-Man back into a teenager while the rest of the Marvel universe remains the same was something John Byrne (and probably Howard Mackie) wanted to do with the character but weren't allowed to. I think their version included Dr. Strange too.

At least, that's Byrne said on his bulletin board on AOL, like, six years ago or something.

That's the first thing I thought about with this One More Day stuff and although I doubt they'll take it as far as Byrne wanted, but I'm still guessing some variation of this story is what happens.

 

[Ice]

Mephisto.

Spidey sells his soul for a new identity, or summink like that.

(I hope not, but that's how they'd do it if they wanted to take the easy route)

Here's my theory:

- Post Civil War: Spider-Man is a fugitive from the government (which we know). He is hunted, so he puts on the black costume to avoid the registered heroes from capturing and putting him in SHIELD custody. He attempts to live his life in NYC all but abandoning his identity.

- Mary Jane and Aunt May, under constant surveilance, are stressed to high heaven by the upheaval in their lives. They continue to live in Stark towers, but more as prisoners than houseguests.

- Through the intervention of Nick Fury, and coordinating with Jarvis being distracted by May, Peter and MJ are allowed "One More Day" together outside of SHIELD surveilance. Peter tells MJ that although he loves her, and will always love her, he cannot keep making her life a living hell. He tells her that he is going to go into hiding under a new identity and that he will not tell her what that identity is, and that he may never see her again. They spend the night together and when she wakes up, he is gone. To make the desire to hunt him down go away Dr. Strange makes her think that Peter has been killed (since Wizard revealed that the "One More Day" story includes Dr. Strange).

- Spider-Man shows up in Chicago, or some other American city, with a new identity. Every few months or so he moves, or he builds up a steady life in one place until the Government liscensed Green Goblin hunts him down, and he's forced to adopt a new life. He remains a member of Captain America's Secret Avengers, working for Fury, but only occasionally. He gets a job as a teacher maybe.

- Meanwhile, MJ realizes she's pregnant, unbeknownst to Peter, and she and Aunt May decide to raise to child far away from New York City. Tony Stark (probably running SHIELD by now) puts her in something like the witness protection program and sends her out into suburbia as a last favor to his friend Peter. Maybe Jarvis moves with them. Maybe Jarvis' witness protection name is Ben and little Peter Parker Jr. has an uncle who can teach him a thing or two about responsibility. Who knows, really.

This Way:
- Helps introduce new supporting cast.
- Single Peter Parker
- No Divorce
- No Death
- Heartbreaking, Defining story with long-lasting ramifications.
- Failsafe to reintroduce the Status-Quo if fan-reception doesn't flow with these moves

Just some speculation on my behalf, but from the preview art I am ABSOLUTELTY convinced that I am right about "One Day More" being the last day MJ and Peter have together.

That is genius. Write Spider-Man, please?

Only thing is, they wouldn't allow the pregnancy. If they anything, MJ would find a paper, be shocked, show Aunt May who would be shocked, too. Still, it's all genius.

 

[thee great one]

The problem was making her a supermodel to begin with.

Or how about let's make Spider-Man gets his powers cause he is some kind of spider totem or some bull****. Instead of some average guy getting powers.

Which is easier to relate to?

I really really depise Joe Q.

 

[TwilightEL]

I really didn't care about MJ, until I read this.

Go down to the "Why Did it Have to be You, Mary Jane" section.

It totally convinced me that she's a necessary part of the comic.

 

[thee great one]

I really didn't care about MJ, until I read this.

Go down to the "Why Did it Have to be You, Mary Jane" section.

It totally convinced me that she's a necessary part of the comic.

She is. If they divorce them or kill her. I would be more pissed than anything else ever.

I read a quote by Joe Q once about how if someone is on a message board *****ing thier heart out about something, then he doesn't have to worry cause they will still buy the book. That annoyed me. It's ok to write crappy stories cause he knows they will still buy it.

This kind of thinking is what made the clone sage and other crap.

 

[TwilightEL]

She is. If they divorce them or kill her. I would be more pissed than anything else ever.

I read a quote by Joe Q once about how if someone is on a message board *****ing thier heart out about something, then he doesn't have to worry cause they will still buy the book. That annoyed me. It's ok to write crappy stories cause he knows they will still buy it.

This kind of thinking is what made the clone sage and other crap.

What a jerk.

I want to write, but I've never really finished a story. And it seems to me one of the best things in the world is for someone to love your story enough to whine about how much it sucks.

Writers shouldn't be slaves to fans--trying to write what's popular, not what's good, is how the clone saga got started. But to just laugh it off when people start to hate what you're doing to the characters because you'll still make a profit is just despicable.

 

[Ice]

The problem was making her a supermodel to begin with.

No, that was the perfect thing to do, because that's what helped people go, "Well, if a guy like him can land a girl like her, I can, too."

 

[Gideon Stargrave]

If you ask me; The problem is the marriage itself. Limiting Peter to only one romantic interest limits story telling. I'm kind of torn though, because the alternative is almost as bad; Having Peter have dozens of on again, off again girlfriends like he did in the 70's and 80's.

The whole "HAHAHA I date thousands of women by day and jump around in my spandex outfit by night!!" thing works for Matt Murdock and Johnny Storm, but not as much Peter Parker.

I don't know what needs to happen with Peter. Both alternatives kind of suck. We need a good writer who spin this in a way that pleases all of us. I'd love to see someone like Brubaker on Spider-Man, adding some noir and good plotting to distract me from all of the issues that the series has.